3/27/2023 Angelique Santos - The Renaissant of Arts, Activist, Tattoo artists, daughter and moreRead NowAngelique SantosAngelique Santos is a renaissance individual of arts, tattooing, writing and is full of curiosity. Her love and passion for humanity, family and culture are applied within her artistic practice which was truly inspiring to me. We sat down on a humid summer day at the Belcher’s Bay promenade and talked about her unique journey, her background and aspirations to the creative community of womxn that may render creatives lost - but how important it’s okay to feel that way. You were part of our wonderful and very first Creative Womxn in Hong Kong exhibition in late June, but I wanted to chase you down a little bit further and talk to you in person a little bit more. I remember that when I was transcribing your artist biography, I read that your inspiration comes from your background and personal relationships which you hope to bring a sense of “awe” to your viewers. So, I was wondering how does creating “awe” inspire you? My artistic practice has changed a lot over the years. I was comfortable in the beginning, when I strictly stuck to the drawing and painting and that was it. That was what we learned, basically as we were growing up. So, I just stuck to that, and I was really good at it. When I went to the Hong Kong Design Institute, I expanded my practice and explored installation and sculpture during my higher diploma. I learned about how powerful installations can be as it’s different from traditional works. With paintings you can only interact with them face to face, but don’t get me wrong there are still paintings that make me cry. But with installation, one of my pieces “To Mother”, dedicated to my mom was a visual and sound installation and it was very personal. It was two channels and one of it was me interviewing my mum about her life and that particular section is on headphones because it is very intimate and towards the end of the interview, she cried, and it was filmed from my own perspective - so you feel like she is talking to you directly. There is this stereotype in Asian culture where moms like to hoard. They like to keep a lot of stuff in their home and my mom falls into this category. I asked her: “We have so many things in the house- out of all of these things, what are the most important things to you?”. The house is literally filled to the brim with crap. And she just said: “Honestly it is the stuff that your dad has left here since he passed away, the pictures of your dad and his idols”. My dad passed away when I was 4 and my both parents are Catholic. So out of all of this stuff this was the most precious to her. And all of this is in the interview. Every single time she talks about my dad she cries. So, I took this ceremonial tablecloth that we use for special occasions like Christmas or on my dad’s birthday, where she would spread it on the table to make a little memorial for him. So that tablecloth is quite fancy, it is not just a pure white tablecloth, and it means a lot to her. And I asked her if I could borrow it and draw on it. And at first, she said “no way” but when I assured her that I would draw in pencil so it could be washed away easily, she agreed. I did a portrait for her where I was holding a picture of my dad and his idols (Mary, Jesus and Joseph) next to me on this tablecloth. I presented it to her by surprise and put it on the table to show it to her. I filmed it when she saw it for the first time and [she] cried as well. And that was the second channel, projected onto a wall. I can imagine that many people, not only within my culture, might go through a similar thing - growing up with a single mother who worked so hard. And when it comes to an installation setting, I think it is just so much more powerful and does so much more when you are immersed in a particular environment. There is a lot to unpack! I was wondering if you also had a chance to see the difference in your family's Filipino culture who lives in Hong Kong within your schoolmates as well. Have you had a chance to maybe compare similar experiences with other families? Well, growing up as a third culture kid (like a lot of kids in Hong Kong), I moved here when I was 1. I was born in the Philippines but the friends I have today are the same kids I met in kindergarten and at church when I was about 3 years old. I’m very grateful for them, they are amazing and are always so supportive. I know that no matter where we go in the world, we’re always there for each other. Some of my friends have gone overseas already and you know it is hard to keep in contact since there are so many things going on, people grow up and get busy, but when they come back it feels like no time has gone by. And even though we are all from different backgrounds, growing up in a different environment was obviously difficult. But my best friend with whom I got my first tattoo a matching one) when we were 16 - growing up with her was sort of a challenge in a way because she is half English and half Scottish and her lifestyle was very different to mine. In what sense? They were wealthier compared to my family. But I never saw that as a competition in any way, we always supported each other. But sometimes I could not help but feel…. that it was hard. Because when you are growing up, being an angsty teen, you tend to compare yourself to others, you think to yourself “this is so unfair”. But I am so grateful for the life that I have, and you get more perspective when you get older. My mum is an incredible person when it comes to this. She did such a fantastic job - raising me. I was a horrible teenager. Really? How come? I just didn’t appreciate everything she has done. And I think there were so many differences between us because she had me when she was 37 and I am her only child. Her growing up in a traditional Filipino household in the Philippines with 9 other siblings on a farm…. That upbringing was completely opposite to mine. We would just fight all the time. But when I was around 17 years old, we sat down and had a heart-to-heart conversation, we both cried, both swore and cried again and laid it all out… and after that we were completely okay (chuckles). I think it’s just miscommunication, it was difficult to understand each other. I told her everything I’ve done. And she wasn’t happy…? Well, I mean I drink, I smoked from an early age. But - isn’t that all of us? She did not do that. That’s why it was so hard. She didn’t go to sleepovers because she had a huge family. She was very strict, never smoked anything and she barely drinks, and is very religious. So, we just decided that we are not going to talk about that. That is also a solution. But it is such a journey of growth and understanding each other as two completely different generations. What was her initial reaction when you started to make your art pieces despite the differences you both had? Well, since high school I have always had trouble figuring out what I want to do. My dad was a journalist for the South China Morning Post in Hong Kong - he was the editor. I always loved English, loved to read and write. So, I thought that maybe I’d do journalism like him. For my A-levels I took English Literature, History and Art. But it was the art I fell in love with. I had the coolest teachers. I felt like I was always the teacher’s pet because I genuinely cared, always listened and took notes. I think that those teachers fostered my growth and inspiration to stick to the arts. When I told my mom that I wanted to pursue art - she would see some of my works, but it was still in high school whilst tackling other 6 subjects: they were still quite underdeveloped. And now when you go on Instagram and see some of the works of high school kids doing art - its mind blowing. So, at that time it was still so-so for my mum because I guess she always wanted me to follow my dad’s footsteps - so I took a gap year in order to figure out what the hell I was doing with my life. What happened during your gap year?
I went to Australia! And when I was there, I met up with my long-time friend Chester. He told me that his brother went to art school and ended up being a tattoo artist which he didn’t need his degree for. So that got me thinking whether I even want to go to university because I have a single mother and university is expensive. I came back to Hong Kong and was trying to look for options to become an apprentice at a tattoo studio to see how that would work out. So, I took another gap year (chuckles) to go to work basically - full time and travel and work at the same time to save up for university just in case I wanted to do it. I couldn't afford to go to university yet, but there are other paths that you can take. So, I researched the Higher Diploma offered at Hong Kong Design Institute. Which is not really a university, but I decided to apply to see if I would get in and I did! So, I mean- I just- at that point I was so confused (laughs) - in what I wanted to do. So I told myself that I would do it - because it was so much cheaper. On my first day, everything was taught in Cantonese BUT that’s how I grew up - being in a local school my whole life. So, you speak Cantonese? Yep. But on the first day I was the only foreigner in my whole course. I mean there was also one friend who was Thai however, he was raised locally as well, and his Cantonese was much better than English anyways. But I am the other way because of high school, I think. Everyone looked at me as being this girl with a pierced nose, tattooed arms, being brown, when the teacher was doing an attendance and noticed me, I was the only one with an English name so when she said my name, everyone turned around to look at me and the teacher said, “oh sorry did you want me to speak English?”. And I said no it’s okay (chuckles). And everyone was so surprised that I could speak in Cantonese. So, it wasn’t difficult to make friends. And everyone was actually very nice and since I was paying for school by myself, I decided to work really hard and help my mom. I was such a shitty teenager, I wanted to redeem myself. So I paid my first year, worked my ass off and I think it also HKDI wasn’t my schoolmates first choice or passion, they didn't really care about being there. But I was working so hard, so I actually ended up getting a lot of scholarships that I didn't have to pay for anything since! I was wondering whether all of these layers of your hard work and experience if it somehow shaped your own creative work as well? I haven’t really thought about the process of shaping it per se but it definitely changed my work mentality at school. Because it took me so long to decide what I wanted to do with my life basically (since it’s 4 years of your life, right) and it is a lot of money, time consuming. Taking a gap year and having a job when you are young is very important. You will appreciate the cost of what you are doing. I wasn’t planning to dick around - pardon my French (laughs). I wasn’t going to waste it. All my experiences in my gap year - it did reinforce my work mentality and it was also because of my family and my upbringing. Growing up around here, family is number one. Kids do not move out until they are basically married. My mum has been super understanding when it came to me being more independent. I decided to move out last year, lived alone for a bit and I always thought that I had to grow up very quickly anyway - my mum had to work, and I was at home. I had my grandma that I recently lost. But she also was a huge part of my upbringing. My mum told me how much my grandma has always wanted to talk to me, but she always had to load the English. Oh, so you did not speak Filipino with each other? Not really - I mean I can understand it. I mostly understand thanks to my Hong Kong friends, because they are all half Filipino like me. But a lot of my friends are also English - half Pinoy half English. I have an international accent - it’s not quite American you can’t really place it, but with Asian qualities (laughs). Have you sometimes found yourself stuck in ways to express yourself? I've been having serious art block lately. After my grandma passed, I started to have so many ideas on how to honour her and how to share her story. She could barely speak English and I wanted people to know who she. I had to shrink back for a bit, stayed in my room, was off of my phone and my partner was wonderful. He really supported me and knew I needed some space. Grief is a funny thing. And what is about love that you invited to your life and you placed it into your creativity? It is much easier when you live with someone, and you can practice your skills on them. You have a life model! One of my works for my latest art class was actually him - standing nude in between doors. I always aim for a more realistic painting style. I lean more towards traditional art. At school they teach you that it is not necessary to be realistic. The point of painting is to put your mark on it as a painter and how you express yourself in this work. This is where it clicked for me. Abstract class for me was horrible - I got a B (laughs). But to be able to explore this- you can’t teach yourself- you need professors. University is so worth it and I’d suggest to people who want to start with this is to keep going, you learn so many new pieces of art history you never knew they existed. What surprised you the most in art history? The way women were perceived in art. Women were always depicted in a way that was shameful or inviting. In history, painting, especially paintings of a nude were a very male dominated practice. They wouldn't let women go into nude painting classes. Women were subjected to landscapes and still lifes that weren’t as impressive as the nude at that time. The nude was a mark that an artist has reached their peak if done right. It is so important for us to learn these things so you can be more aware of other paintings and learn from them. That is how my recent self-portrait as a Filipina came to be. I got inspired by Gauguin who went to Tahiti, and he painted Tahitian women - all looking ashamed and subjected to the male gaze. That is why I painted myself with gold earrings like my grandma and this big chunky gold necklace that mimicked the one she has always worn as well. What are your plans for your final university project? My work has always been surrounded by identity and culture. My final year at university has been filled with courses that have prepared me for my Honours project. I have taken economics and history courses that focus on poverty, discrimination which I have referenced in my research for my upcoming community-based art project. My project will be centred around migrant domestic workers in Hong Kong, I need to do more research through the Filipino community here in Hong Kong and how it is perceived because when you say Filipino in Hong Kong, you can't help but think about domestic workers. Even though these workers only have one day off per week and are subject to abuse or overwork, they still have time and willingness to create a sense of community together. There are so many elements to it, it has motivated me to volunteer for the Mission for Migrant Workers so that I can get a better insight and understanding to the individuals within this huge community. It’s hard for me to break through this barrier because I don’t really speak the language and I don’t look particularly Filipina. I know I have to get over my fears because this project means so much to me and I hope it’ll have a positive impact and outcome.
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Sue Pollard - Midwife, newborn photograper and guardian to a new lifeAs I approach the end of my pregnancy, I wanted to celebrate such a special journey and invite my fantastic midwife Sue Pollard to share insight into the world of midwifery. Sue works for Annerley Midwives and has guided me through all of those 9 months, educating me through every stage of the way. Sue kindly agreed to chat with me to share her personal journey, the science and evidence based facts regarding pregnancies, all of the pregnancy myths, tips and tricks and her love for newborn photography as well. You’ve been a bus driver before becoming a midwife. What was the transition and what made you change your career paths? Oh my goodness. I have done so many things. My journey to midwifery is an interesting one. I was a bus driver, and then I got a job as an off-licence manager, this is where I met my husband. Whilst doing this, I started doing an Open University science course. I really loved it. My daughter was about 11 years old at that stage and I was looking at potential job opportunities for her - to know what she should be thinking of studying at school. Since her aunt is a nurse, I was just randomly looking at nursing stuff on the Internet and seeing what happens and what she would need. I stumbled across midwifery, and it ticked all of the boxes for me. I already had 2 children, so had an idea about childbirth. As soon as I started reading through all the requirements that it takes to become a midwife, I thought to myself “wow, yeah I could do that, I found something I can do and would truly enjoy doing!” My Open University courses meant I already had the entry qualifications. So, I contacted the course director of the university near me, and it just so happened that she has also done the same Open University course! Destiny! Destiny! So, I gave up my job at the off-licence and moved a bit closer to the university and went back to bus driving, so that I could fund myself through the course. I guess the rest is history. What were the requirements that ticked the boxes for you? Well, I don’t know why I thought that I would need loads more qualifications than those I already had. And it’s not something I would necessarily have considered before. However, the Open University course gave me the same science and the biology background that I needed to get onto the course in the first place, plus I found I really loved the biology. The idea of helping someone through such a lifechanging experience really appealed to me. Was it always Biology that you’ve always been attracted to? No, not really (chuckles). What happened was that my husband studied physics and science at university, and I was always saying “I could not do that, it’s way too brainy for me…!” And he said “No, actually you could, try this…”. So, I tried it and was like “wow” - I sucked it up like an empty sponge. So, I absolutely loved all the education and then being with women. That brings me to another question - it must be quite challenging to be part of this miraculous scientific process, at the same time as being surrounded with all of these pregnant hormonal mums or children carriers to be. So, what is it actually about being around pregnant people? You know when somebody is getting married, and everyone seems to want to hover around the bride? So, with pregnant women I get to be that person that is there with them - holding their hand all the way through this whole pregnancy process. Then I get to see them and meet with the baby. It’s a very positive experience, not like something that you get with general nursing, where you might have an ill patient. I guess it is very different from nursing in that respect. I just love going through the whole process with people. Seeing them becoming parents and develop as parents - witnessing the whole transition is fantastic. I may not remember every single woman that I ever met but I’m pretty sure that a lot of those women will remember me. So I want to make sure that I give them something very positive to look back on. Especially somewhere like Hong Kong where you have a lot of expats and they don’t have their families with them, I am so lucky that I get to be that person that helps you through that whole process which is so rewarding for me. There are so many physical, biological and psychological aspects to it. Absolutely! Everything comes together and everyone’s transformation, including coping mechanisms, is so different, isn’t it? Yes! And I feel that having had two children of my own I kind of have an idea where people are coming from. Although I haven’t done it in Hong Kong, I have been through the process of having a baby. That makes perfect sense. I was wondering how difficult it is for you to keep yourself updated with all of the new trends and science researches that come up for midwifery. When I look at the internet there are so many trends there that keep progressing and changing so much… So I need to make sure that my practice is always evidence based, not based on hearsay or on chat forums. There will always be so many different opinions such as to “my mum said this, my dad said that, and this is what we used to do, and my mum said that this is what she did with me”. I am a member of the Royal College of Midwives. They send important and updated data. Then at home on my computer, I have subscribed to a newsfeed that comes up on my homepage every day that tells me what’s going on, regarding research. On Facebook, I am a member of several groups that are specific to science or midwifery. For example, one of them is looking into Microbiome, one into Evidence based Midwifery etc. I think it’s all about having your finger in loads of places that are engaged in monitoring the sources, really. That includes reading the NICE guidelines (note: NICE guidelines are evidence-based recommendations for health and care in England) and keeping yourself updated with any changes. What was the latest trend that you recently bumped into? I am quite into looking at the microbiome at the moment which I mentioned before. And that is the relationship between the baby getting the bacteria from the mother’s vagina and that helping to programme the baby & immune system. So when, for example, people have a caesarean section without having their water breaking or the baby coming through the vagina, then the baby doesnt get the same type of microbes. That is an emerging aspect of childbirth that I think needs more attention. That is fascinating, indeed. I think it was about two days ago when I bumped into this “news” when people go through a c-section, apparently even when they have their curtain in front of them that they want to take the baby out of their own womb by themselves? Yes (chuckles), some people still want to feel like that they still have the childbirth experience as it’s “meant to be”. I think that most doctors would much rather be the ones who lift the baby out of the uterus then handing it to the mother but that is more about making sure that it is all sterile and reducing infection. However, there should always still be a possibility of doing the skin to skin contact with the baby, and delaying the cord clamping as well, before removing the placenta. And I guess that is another trend - delaying the cord clamping that has massive physiological and emotional benefits for the mother and the baby. What would you like people to learn about their pregnancy and about the whole process of being pregnant? I guess if there is anything that they don’t feel sure about, go and research it. If anybody tells you anything - doctors, friends, anybody, and you are still not quite sure - just go and research it. It may be factually correct with a good amount of evidence behind it, or maybe this is just another thing that someone found on the Internet. Do you have any favourite sources where to look? I would suggest looking into places that have evidence-based guidelines, such as the NICE guidelines or the Lullaby Trust (good place to look for things like infant’s cot death and baby safety). If you want to look at scientific journals, try Google Scholar. What are the most ridiculous myths about pregnancy and labour that made you laugh? Probably if you are carrying your baby very high or low, determining the gender of your baby. There is one more that is probably more “Hong Kong myth” and it can work both ways, but I’ve heard people saying if you are carrying a baby girl, she sucked all of your beauty - (so basically someone is telling them that they are ugly). I even had a colleague telling me that because I am craving pineapple during pregnancy then it definitely must be a girl! Yeah! You cannot tell the gender of the baby by just looking at somebody (chuckles), neither will any particular food cravings that you may experience. Coming back to you - you have lived in Hong Kong for over 8 years, what was the biggest culture shock that you learned? Oh! Some of the Hong Kong style of doing things - like for example the Confinement (ancient postpartum practice that comes from China) ladies and the family doing things, like for example: “We need to wrap up the person who just gave birth and keep her very warm so that the cold does not get into them”. So, when I go to their homes for the first time after giving birth and see them with mastitis and a temperature 39 degrees I say “we need to cool this person down” the mothers always come and wrap them even more, so they get even hotter. Or the next one would be not even bathing, using only ginger water, for basic hygiene for the first whole month. I’m sure it is based on some truth somewhere down the line, but in the modern age? Please shower (laughs). You need to be careful of infection and be mindful of these things. That must be quite hard - if you go to their homes after giving birth and their parents are there with them to “help them recover” - how do you communicate it out? I can only tell them the research and I don’t want to be drawn into a lot of debates over cultural norms and science. There is often a clash sometimes - yes, it can be quite uncomfortable - all I can do is to show them the latest evidence-based research. I need to recognize when to step back and also recognize that the health of Hong Kongers in general is really good - who knows maybe they are onto something that we in a Western world got wrong! What is it about your own personal pregnancies that you would change, after gathering all of the knowledge as a midwife? If I would have the chance to relive my pregnancies again with the knowledge that I have right now, I’m not sure if I would change a huge amount about my pregnancies, however I was a smoker back then (chuckles, hangs head!) - I wouldn’t be a smoker, and I would have had a healthier lifestyle back then. But the thing I would change the most would be the process of labour and the birth. Back then I was a ‘very good girl’ and I thought that I had to sit on the bed and have my IV. and just basically sit there while they were monitoring the baby for six hours and then follow the instructions on the pushing process. Right now, I would definitely do hypnobirthing, would have a lot of candles, some relaxing music, maybe a water birth if I was in the right place, move around and just be comfortable and do whatever I felt like. I would want to eat and drink all the way through rather than being in this cold clinic environment - I’d love to change it into more of a spa environment. Do you think that it is more dangerous for first time pregnancies to give birth at home? No! (chuckles). The research has shown that it is safer for women to give birth at home in low-risk pregnancies. Obviously high-risk pregnancies are something completely different. But if you have a low risk pregnancy and are supported by a midwife - do it! However It may not be as easy to do it in Hong Kong - it is still lacking the support of the medical community and it is not widely accepted in Hong Kong. Maybe at some point in the future it will change. It would be lovely if it did. But in countries where you can give birth at home and it is supported by the medical services then yep - absolutely go for it, as long as you are supported by an experienced midwife, who is ready to transfer you to the obstetrics unit if the need arises. How many home births have you had a chance to give, so far? Well, none in Hong Kong. I haven’t done that many - probably about 4 or 5. However please bear in mind when I was in the UK, most of my time was spent working in the hospital. If I had been working in the community, that would probably be different. I was working at the Midwife-led, standalone birthing unit where it was just me, healthcare assistant, a couple of birthing pools and no doctors. In fact, if we would need a doctor, we would have to put the person giving birth in an ambulance, for a 20-minute journey to a hospital. So that was like the next step up from a homebirth. I loved that job (laughs). You also do newborn photography! So I was wondering how did you start? Well, I was doing a home visit. I had already been doing my photography for a while - I’ve done a couple of wedding shoots (which I hated…) Oh really, why? Well at weddings you get a one chance to get THE shot and if you don’t get it right on the day, it’s not like you can bring them all back in and do it all over again. It is very stressful. So I did a couple of those, I did some landscapes and also did some more fashion-type beauty type shots for women, which I quite enjoyed but I kind of felt like people thought that if they were having photos of themselves, it was a bit vain. So, I was doing a home visit for this one lady, and she had had some photos gifted to her from her family member. She showed me her photos and I was pretty sure that even without any newborn photography training, I could make a better job of it. So I asked if she would like me to go around and try. She said yes - and it kind of started from there. Of course, it started with the whole journey of learning how to be a newborn photographer. A couple of years ago I set up my own business. It definitely gives me a creative outlet to what I love doing, which is midwifery, and they go hand in hand - making sure that the baby is safe. I always take my husband along. He is an extra pair of hands and ensures safety by observing the baby whilst I am trying to capture the shot. That’s lovely getting support from your husband as well! He doesnt get a choice!!! (laughs). He is very good - he wants to support me in my hobbies too! He is not as comfortable around newborns as I am, but he is quite happy to sit there and pat the baby’s bum for a few minutes whilst I’m getting everything sorted (laughs). My last question is whether you would be willing to share a few extra tips for someone who is experiencing their first pregnancy? Don’t listen to any of the negative stories - if somebody wants to always offload their story to you, it is a very cathartic thing FOR THEM - just put your hand up, say “STOP, I will listen to this after the birth of my baby, I don’t want or need to be hearing it now”. Don’t listen to anybody’s negative experiences, fill your head with positive thoughts because that is going to help you have a positive mindset. If you are thinking about the worst things that can go wrong - how is that actually going to help you? Having a positive mindset is going to increase your oxytocin and will help you to be in a more positive mindset which will benefit your baby as well. When you are in a negative mindset, you are more likely to have a high level of adrenaline and stress and that’s not going to be helping you or your baby. Follow Sue on Instagram: dbay_photography
Sue's Website: dbayphotography.com Annerley Midwives Website: annerley.otandp.com Annerley Midwives Facebook: AnnerleyMidwives 10/26/2022 The Hanuman Charity sister heroines - saviours of Hong Kong street sleepers and homelessRead NowBianca and Samiha (along with celebrating their father Nick as a charity founder)Imagine immersing yourself into a position where you lost absolutely everything. Your roof, your income, access to food, essential support. That is all gone. People look at you through fingers, they don't want to make an eye contact with you because this has "obviously was meant to be your fault" - for ending up on a street and eventually abusing substances as this is the only coping mechanism that you have for your survival. Surviving another day without food, another day without shelter, surviving and hoping to be safe and not mugged. Hanuman Charity sees these people and is curious about them in how to help them. Sisters Bianca and Samiha along with their father Nick introduce this community to local Hong Kongers to witness the cost of this problem and how we can tackle it. They go and help out 6 times a week - after their university or a full time job, outside on the streets with donated food packages that they need to prepare at their home and distribute them to street sleepers and homeless people along with volunteers. By doing so, they work on giving these people a sense of hope for a better future. We had a chat about how we can achieve this whilst showing the true mirror to Hong Kong residents who cannot see beyond the glamour of Hong Kong's light show and glamorous lifestyle. How did you feel when your dad, for the first time, came to you and told you “I want to start a charity”? SAMIHA: Well for me, it was…well I wasn’t necessarily against it, but already had a lot of responsibilities on top of this idea of my dad’s. I did not even start studying by then. I kind of used to shy away from any conversation that my dad had. For example giving stuff, boxes and food away. Bianca, on the other hand, was very helpful to dad right away (laughs). BIANCA: Many charities by then were already connected with dad so we had a sense what had to be done and I’ve always wanted to give it a try, I was always like “Oh yay, let’s go for a walk let’s give it a try.” SAMIHA: Yeah, whilst I already have so many things to do and to think about my future. And on top of that, starting a family charity was something that seemed to be quite overwhelming at first. Of course I am not against being part of the charity but there are also some other responsibilities that I had to take care of. And then it kind of got to a point when I had to go for one of our charity walks, because Bianca had exams and could not participate. Dad asked me to go along, as on that day we had less volunteers and needed the extra help. It was the Sunday walk which is probably one of the longest and more tiring ones since we had to give out about 200 meals within a few hours. I just lost my mind. I reflected on everything that has been happening in my life. These people that I saw on the streets had nothing of what I have, whether they don't have money or even a house or a roof , seeing all of this opened my eyes to my priorities. So I was like “you know what now I definitely need to take time for this”. It was not about doing the good for me and making myself feel good but to proactively help someone in need. So, why not? It’s simple. Bianca, you were very enthusiastic from the very beginning… BIANCA: Oh yeah, I was running around, saying “let’s go let’s go, I wanna help” (laughs). In India we used to have these elderly people begging by the temples and we always gave them something to eat. Since we ended up visiting India and seeing poverty there, I was already very conscious of people who truly need the help because the government won't simply do that. It was a no brainer to continue supporting these people in Hong Kong as well. Can you describe to me the feelings you had from your first charity walk you ever did? What did you notice and what shocked you? SAMIHA: Well for the walk that changed my mind about being part of this charity was the fact that the drug use that is happening around the Hong Kong parks is so shockingly open. Especially all drugs being illegal in Hong Kong, none seemed to care. The fact that those people who were using the drugs were way over their retirement age. They should be living a comfortable life, like maybe with their children and grandchildren and with whatever savings that they have. But instead, they are on the street and sleeping on the roads, out in the park, openly injecting themselves. They can’t do anything about it. For them to even get a job because it’s already way over their retirement age and with their addiction it is absolutely impossible. These people turned into the point when they started to abuse drugs that even that 1% of a chance for them to get at least a cleaning job, they can’t do it anymore, because they are so dependent on the drugs. That walk to me was purely mind blowing and shocking at the same time to even witness this sad picture. And that was also specifically for the first Sunday walk that we do. For the TST walks especially, you know, Hong Kong is such a big beautiful glamorous city. When I initially came to Hong Kong, I thought about it as this rich city and everything is super expensive…and from then after our walks you see this completely different face of Hong Kong - when you see people living on the streets who at some point need to beg for money or dig through trash cans to get food. People are very good at turning a blind eye, especially to the sad things that are happening here but I’m just so glad to be part of something where I can truly help. Do you remember your first walk, Bianca? BIANCA: My first walk was actually when we went to feed people who lived in a subway. There was so much smell, the conditions that they were living in were so suffocating and hot. That was the first time when I went out to help out dad and I was purely shocked about that overall. I’ve used subways in different districts around Hong Kong and I have never seen anything like that. These people really truly need help. Another one of the first walks I did was when I met this older lady who was around 80 years old and she was picking up rotten vegetables from a trash can. She always carried this small gas stove with her where she was then cooking the vegetables that she picked up. My dad spoke to her in Cantonese and asked her what happened to her and how come that she ended up on a street. She said that she has been in Hong Kong for 12 years already and told us many stories about when she was sleeping at a park and there were men who came to her and tried to touch her as well. And for us, having a grandma at home that really made me feel horrible - being an alone elderly lady and being treated like this, that was definitely something that pushed me to go forward and keep being persistent with the help that we do. That is so intense. I can’t even imagine, since I remember my first walk that I did with Hanuman Charity, the images that you see from that day stay with you at the back of your head. How did your dad pick up and choose the locations? SAMIHA: I think that it was through word of mouth. My dad obviously has been part of other charities as well. There are specific locations and pockets in Hong Kong where you can find someone being able to sleep in a safer environment. So my dad got to know a bunch of stories where he heard certain groups of people survive and live together in certain areas. And all of these groups of people move around a lot too like for example Jordan, or this and that place. So my dad kind of connected the dots and figured out the trails where these people might be hovering around - he built a map so we could figure out different sides of Hong Kong on different days and separate them. It would not be possible to do it all in one day. BIANCA: But even when we started in 2019, we started off with giving out meals in 25 boxes and now it’s about 650. But during those beginnings when we only had 25 meals to give out, we found out that it was easy to do it and it became a sort of a new adventure after work to keep an eye on these people and walk around certain locations to find the needy people. Once when people got used to our times and days that we stuck to, the street sleepers started to come back to meet us and get their meals - and the cleaners who clean the markets too. The cleaners actually connected us with more locations as well. I’m always so impressed that you guys can always recognize so many familiar faces already. How do you actually recognize a poor street sleeping person without being rude? Is it because they automatically ask for food? SAMIHA: It depends on the district. For example on our Sunday walks we would be able to tell who is homeless by their clothing or their overall condition. But if you go to areas like in TST, you would not be able to look at them and recognize if they are living in poverty or on a sidewalk. For dad, he has a specific way of talking. If you would come up to someone and ask them “hey are you homeless?” it is quite rude. There are different ways to say it in Chinese, so my dad understood the correct tone to be able to ask them in a polite way so it does not offend them. If you offend them of course they are not going to take the food. At the end it comes down to the fact that they kind of start to trust you and understand that no matter if it’s raining or super hot weather, we always come back to give them the meals. BIANCA: I think dad usually does that, since he does this regularly with the passion that he has, that may have some sort of super power (laughs). He can just purely look at someone and say “oh look at that guy I saw him two years ago still struggling” and I always ask him “ how do you even know, how can you remember?” (laughs). SAMIHA: (laughs) Yeah, he is very good at face recognition. BIANCA: Ever since he started the charity, his eyesight became so good (laughs). He can see and recognize people from miles away. SAMIHA: I guess it’s the passion that increases the sense (laughs). That’s incredible. I was wondering if you also had a chance to, even due to lack of not knowing Cantonese, if you had a chance to hear and listen to their stories? How did they end up living on a street in the first place? SAMIHA: There is a guy that we met at the Hong Kong Island side and he is not Chinese. He is actually from Fiji. I don't exactly know the story but he used to have a full time job and he lost it because of Covid. BIANCA: Oh yeah, I think he was married and his wife was sent back to Fiji. So he was here working a full time job to send her money back. But then he ended up falling in love with a Filipina lady and had a child with her as well. So he sent the Filipina lady and the child back to the Philippines. So he was still working here and sending the money back to two countries already. There was this bridge that we used to pass by from work, almost every day and one day he just lost his job because of Covid. He could not pay the rent and the landlord kicked him out of the house and gave him a chance to only pack some of his stuff and leave. So he only took a small bag of clothes and did not know where to go. So everytime we passed under that bridge, he lived in a small space right there. So my dad found him and he told him this story. We were always so shocked that the fact you end up on the street does not happen only to local people but to expats as well. SAMIHA: Yeah, it was such a shock, hearing him being desperate and not knowing how to keep his wife and his lover and the son alive. I believe that now he actually has a part time job, where he cleans after parties in some bars and clubs. Yeah I remember, because your dad on the charity walks is always trying to give you a little bit more of a background story for you to empathise more with the people who ended up on the street and that this has never been their choice. Do you think that this homeless crisis became worse with Covid? SAMIHA: Yeah I think that Covid was definitely a big contribution to the crisis. Despite Covid not happening in the past and they already were homeless already, after it hit it made the whole situation even much worse. The guy from Fiji lost absolutely everything because of that and took him a long time to find a new job. Covid disrupted so many people’s lives and so many people lost their jobs. The fear from Covid just increased and that was the reason why so many companies laid off their staff as they were also closing down. Job is very important to be able to survive in Hong Kong and if you don't have that then….you end up in a lot of pain and get stuck. What do you think that Hong Kongers still do not completely resonate with helping out to charities and volunteering? Why do you think they give the side eye that you mentioned at the beginning? SAMIHA: I feel that a lot of people like me, for example, are so prioritised with their own life that they want to focus on and make it their priority number one. And I don't judge them, they should be able to do it for themselves. But once when you actually witness it first hand and see that these homeless people cannot do absolutely anything for themselves. Homeless people can’t ask for social housing, they don’t have three months of deposit for rent to give out, they don’t have two years of administrative waiting to see if any miracle is going to happen for them. You kind of understand that you need to help them- So if you are so focused on your own priorities, you would never be able to see anything else that is around you. So personally this was the aspect that made me be a bit more blindsided to the whole situation. BIANCA: I think that people have a different way of thinking about social problems. Many of our volunteers join us for two or three walks and seem okay with witnessing the whole situation, because they challenge the perception of “well if they can do drugs why can't they get a job?” But in fact once when you get to know the situation, you would know that these homeless did want to find a job, they never left anything behind only just to do the drugs. It is based on the desperate experience that led them to do the drugs. Many of the Hong Kongers still think in such a distant and non-empathic way because they don’t see the whole side of the story so they don’t have that need to help them. And it is the same with feeding, some people think that when you feed them, you feed someone who can get food on their own and that they get used to you coming and providing free food to them. Many of them unfortunately have that kind of thinking and don’t see what is actually happening underneath the carpet. But many of them went through so much that led them to being this way, homeless. I also don't understand - regarding community centres are not more active in matters of providing more shelter when there is for example a typhoon. Why do they keep being closed? Can you tell us a little bit more what happens, once the community centres are open? Do the street sleepers even want to go there? SAMIHA: I am not really sure about other districts but on the Sunday walks there is a certain community centre that is supposed to be open more frequently during extreme weather conditions. People are being threatened with heat strokes and that is certainly no fun to deal with. And during typhoons, many of us are being advised to stay indoors and tape your windows so that you won’t get injured. But what about these people? So shouldn’t they have a backup option where they can invite all of these people to bring them in, because the chance of having something fall on them and die is much greater and much higher risk. These community centres are meant to give a temporary shelter but the openings are never stable. For the first two years that I started going out for these walks I started to notice that they just never open. There is a chain and a lock around the door everytime we pass it. What is the point? BIANCA: It was also around the third year of doing the charity and all the walks when there was once a typhoon 8 and the community centre was open. We were so excited to finally see it. So we once went there to provide the meals, but that was it. We have never seen it being open again. Some street sleepers don't even want to go there because it may not be safe. People are being robbed there, it stinks and during Covid, everyone was sleeping there on a thin mattress super close to each other. Not many people also have their original documents and IDs to be able to sleep in there. SAMIHA: Dad has also already communicated with some of them like “hey the centre is now open, why don’t you want to go there?” And they many times said in a negative tone that it is not so great there, there is no fresh air, four walls …for them to stay on the streets the main thing is that they need to look out for being mugged or being molested, especially for the ladies. The only little bits that they have are all carried in their own pockets or a small bag that they need to protect during the night. It’s so sad to hear. We as a society have so many things and they have these 3 things that they need to protect with their own lifes. So it is better for them to actually stay on the road because they have their own space under control. BIANCA: Even for the elderly lady that we have mentioned before, she had this trolley - very similar to the one that you can see that cardboard grannies have. So one day we got her new clothes and plenty of vegetables for her to take and my dad asked her - “why don't we get you a new trolley”, since she was pushing this massive thing already. But it was all of the stuff that she just basically wanted to hoard and keep. She became very defensive about having her stuff touched and it was the same for her trolley. So going back to the community centre, she can't give up her trolley where all of her possessions are and risk having everything stolen. Do you think that if any of these homeless people would try to reach out for help,reach out to police, is there even enough help and support for them? If they were mugged for example, would the police even be happy to help them? SAMIHA: I feel like for most of the homeless people they are very flegmatic when it comes to being robbed. There is not much value for their things anyway. If the police are called there is still not so much they can do, if it was a pair of shorts or t-shirt or a phone. But we lose our phones all the time and we know how difficult it is to trace it. So for them, it would probably be twice as hard. For them all of the things kind of come and go. And I cant blame the police too there is not much you can do when they lose their stuff.The problem would be to replace the things. And if there would be any other crime, I’m sure that there must be some fights or any safety threatening situations - when you mentioned the molesting. If granny would report something like this, is there something that they can still do? BIANCA: Yes, I think that they will obviously help out, but the granny herself would not physically go to the police. But it was on one of our walks where we witnessed a fight happening and the police took one of the people who started the fight to the station immediately. He ended up in a prison for a few weeks. So the police definitely helps around whether you are homeless or not. Speaking of grannies, since this was one of my culture shocks I’ve witnessed since moving to Hong Kong, I was wondering if you can tell us a little bit more about the “cardboard” grannies? (Side note: Cardboard grannies in Hong Kong are usually elderly ladies who are over 65 years old and collect paper cardboards on the streets with heavy metal trolleys on Hong Kong streets). SAMIHA: We haven’t had a chance to properly dive in deep into their personal stories, however if you see them around, most of them are already over retirement age which is shocking to see them doing such hard work. I feel like they turned into a cardboard collection, because they would not be able to get another job.So this is a way for them to make at least some kind of income. They are being paid 70cents per kilo of collected cardboards! BIANCA: Many of the grannies actually even try to wet the cardboards to make them heavier, so they could get paid more. I also wanted to speak about the Hanuman Charity Volunteers, actually. What kinds of people come and do the walks with you? BIANCA: We always had a diverse group. Firstly, we have always started with contacting all of our friends and family friends so it was mostly an Indian community. Then as it slowly started to spread the word and started promoting it on social media, since we were so small we really wanted to raise awareness to more people about this problem as much as we could. Mixes of expats and locals started coming, but it took about two years to have regulars who would always come back. Volunteers come and go, sometimes they come once or they give up halfway through the walk because it may sometimes be quite an intense picture to witness. Or also on the other hand that they are so shocked that they want to keep coming back more regularly and it’s even children too. SAMIHA: And there is always never enough of the volunteers. Anytime and anyone can think of helping out, there is always a capacity and always a time to do it. BIANCA: Yeah for us as Indians, we always have this thing when someone celebrates their birthday or passes away - we always help the poor people by giving out donations which makes sense as well to have an excuse to help out (laughs). Do you think that it would be more meaningful if more local people would come and volunteer in order to understand this crisis about their own country in person? BIANCA:Yes, for example on our TST walks on Sunday evenings we have quite a bit of locals who are joining us on a regular basis which is great to see. But obviously it would be great if more would be able to see and witness the shock to their system that is happening in their own city underneath the carpet. Even for us - coming from India and witnessing the poverty there, we are always happy to give out the helping hand but for Hong Kongers it is a proper shocking experience finding out about this side of poverty that is hiding behind all of these financial hubs, skyscrapers and the glamorous light show. Even the street sleepers in Tsim Sha Tsui actually look like normal people, who are also watching the light show. But after the show ends they go back to sleep on their cardboards. So yeah, it may be hard for locals to be able to realise that until they come and see it in person. I think once word of mouth is going to form a stable proper group, the locals will start joining more as well. SAMIHA: A lot of locals who already came to join us always spoke about being part of another charity as well. So for them it’s also pretty much about being able to schedule and prioritise their free time and really dedicate themselves around charity - include at least an hour in it. Our own schedules are suited to the charity around the whole week really and trying to make everything happen around our own lives - starting off with arranging the meals to preparing the food bags and then to take the bags and physically carry them to the places. But we never pressure anyone to always come back and keep coming back or even finishing the whole walk. Even if you spend an hour with us and see the situation - that’s what matters to us. The realisation and the button in your head just automatically flips. It’s simple as karma is - you do good you be good. The only barrier would be just the language barrier between us but we have always been able to communicate since our dad already speaks perfect Cantonese. And there is never any fear or block about helping out and being part of charity. It’s about the heartfelt connection when you see the street sleepers opening their food box and starting to eat immediately with so much gratitude and humbleness. Make sure to check Hanuman Charity Website here: hanumancharity.org
Follow Hanuman Charity on Instagram: @hanuman.charity her afternoon (ft. Scentory HK)her afternoon is a charming minimalist illustrator who creates vulnerable yet peaceful space and worlds in her works. When you look at her work, you get lost in a little and that’s what makes it fascinating. her afternoon is based in Taiwan but recently had an exhibition in Hong Kong, curated by Scentory Hong Kong. We had a wonderful online chat where we not only spoke about Her Afternoon work and the characters in it, but also art, films and music. We’ve also discussed what makes us as a society vulnerable and why we struggle to be tuned in with each other.Thank you to Scentory HK for making this interview happen. So nice to meet you! Nice to meet you too! Are you from Hong Kong? Yes I am yeh! And you are currently in Taiwan, right? Yes, I am. I’m so glad that you have time to do this with me! Congratulations to your exhibition that just recently finished in Hong Kong. How do you feel after that? It made me reflect on how my artwork can evolve and what I really want to convey to the folk in the future. I actually have stopped drawing for a few weeks and immersed myself in more books and movies. Yet, I keep thinking, travelling, and reflecting in order to experience life to stay inspired. Yeah that is so important to keep yourself inspired. I was wondering about the name of your exhibition which was called “Distance - The Retrospective of our lives” that heavily focused on the pandemic and the fragility of human connections - how was the isolation and lockdown to you? Well I think isolation can be both physical and mental. Hong Kong’s lockdown was relatively brief and less pervasive compared to some other countries. Yet, it still created huge barriers to human connection, especially after the collective trauma we had experienced in the past few years. People lose faith, hope, and trust. And COVID just rubbed salt on the bleeding wound. Another isolation I experienced was the isolation from time, particularly the future. I hardly planned anything. I couldn't imagine what would happen in one year and how our lives would be. There was a sense of melancholy and loss. I find it very fascinating that even going through so much stress and the confusion that was happening around the world you were still able to create very calm and peaceful artworks! It has never been an easy task for me. I pursue, via art, to keep that little hope and small joys around. Our world has already been very chaotic. We can't even spend some time talking to ourselves, or listening to ourselves. It became harder for us to recognize what is true and what we really want. Most of the people in the world kept losing hope and the home within themselves. Not many people can still be able to reach this kind of reflection like you do. It is great to find such focus within your work. I was wondering if you can tell me a little bit more about your technique? What is your process like? My drawings are created digitally so I use ipad. There is this programme called procreate That helps me all the way through. When it comes to the process, I read many stories and look at so many photos on a daily basis. I observe the details of people’s lives, on how they talk, their interactions. I love nature, so I also observe the trees, the clouds. This helps me pay more attention to things that appear naturally around me. Sometimes I just picture them, write some words and then I just try to draw that vision in my head. So when you look at people during your observations, what type of conversations and interactions do you choose to be your inspiration for your next piece? Have you watched the movie called HER? Yes! The one with Joaquin Phoenix! It’s one of my favourite movies! There was a scene where the AI called Samantha spoke into his ear and they were out together. They looked and observed groups of people sitting in a restaurant. He started to imagine what the people were talking about and what were their personalities and their relations to each other. So my imagination is very similar to that. I enjoy watching people talking to each other and observing what they have in common. I also like watching surreal things and misplaced situations, misplaced objects that are more abstract. For example when I view the sunset, read a novel, or watch a film. I try to match it to my imagination to create something new. My brain sometimes cannot content the amount of imagination that I have so my way of expressing it all is to draw about it. Can you please tell me a little bit more about the name “her afternoon”? Where did it come from? I think again it brings us back to the movie HER which I really like and I really like being surrounded by women. Being a female to be able to be sensitive, fearless at the same time makes me very glad for being a girl in general. I have so many feelings towards gender and don’t want to go super deep into gender issues, but for me personally as a human being I feel a sense of pride to be able to create my work and to draw as a woman. The name “her” represents one of my main identities attached to my work. And the afternoon is simply because it is my favourite time of the day - it is the time of the day when I can feel the fresh breeze, can feel cosy, relaxed. I want to create a relaxing afternoon for the people who see my artwork. You mentioned being very proud of being a woman. Here is a question - what do you think is the best and the worst of being a woman in today’s time? I couldn’t say it’s the worst of being a woman, but the physical vulnerability is really a constraint for me to live with a sense of security when compared to a man. I am still sometimes afraid of walking alone in the dark of some unfamiliar places. But at the same time, I am very proud of the tenderness and complexity of emotions that a woman could have. And most of the time, men will be easily judged by others if they are being sentimental, and that’s not the case for women. My sentiment and sensitivity could be expressed and embraced freely. Hm. I think that's very interesting that you are trying to find the balance and the harmony between the two when it comes to equality. This brings me to one specific emotion which you expressed and mentioned many times in your works as well which is a pain. As a society I feel like we’ve experienced so much shared pain - how do you think that people can learn from the shared pain as such? I think that the paradox of shared pain is the same as the paradox of loneliness. We share the pain and we feel lonely together. We always feel lonely, but we are all feeling lonely together. Some pain or sorrow is always shared. We may have some loss or we miss someone, but all the feelings you have are unique. But all of us can together feel them and experience them. It is so beautiful to find connection with others through something that we feel like we are all alone to experience it. On the other hand you need to face all of the ups and downs through your own experience which is completely yours, but it always helps to have someone with you to share and understand that journey of yours as well. There are still so many little things - we share the pain but we share the happiness too. Even though you are having a really bad day, there is always the sunset to look at, there is always someone new to meet with, a cute puppy to hug. It’s the little things that can still support you to keep going until the next day. It is the smallest ordinary things that are the most important for us to notice and for us to appreciate. I think I’ve definitely been through the most difficult last 2 years and yet I’m so grateful to feel the pain and enjoy the happiness after. It helped me to understand how frustrated and vulnerable life can become. I still have the faith for everything to get better and I hope that people will sense it from my drawings that all I want to show is the peace of mind. Yeah, that is really nicely put, sometimes it can be very hard to understand this in order to realise it. Yes and I hope that people will also appreciate the loneliness too. You can feel lonely but you are not alone because there are still so many other people that feel lonely but they are not alone. The levels of complexity are of course different, but still the same. Within your art and your drawings, you mentioned that you don't have any boundaries and there is nothing that restricts you in order to create. But I was wondering what are your own actual personal boundaries? I think that I have clear boundaries when it comes to people. In my drawings everything can be pretty much ambivalent. I’m quite clear in things that I like or dislike. Within my boundaries, I like the consistency that goes with it - the same goes for people. If someone says something, what are they thinking or feeling, I expect them to act like it - not just saying it. Can you think of some examples? I think I would say I always have reservations on some very sounding or popular issues or people. I would observe if the content or essential properties implied or reflected by a notion are consistent with most of the people suggested. I like genuine things. Agree. Especially in the time of social media where everything seems perfect, right? It also comes with some mainstream, popular things - it can be too much and too overwhelming for me (chuckles). Coming back to your work - I had this feeling that every single piece of yours they portray a different emotion. I was wondering whether you have a favourite emotion that you would like to capture in your work, which one would it be?
Maybe solitude if there is such an emotion like it? It’s probably more likely a state that you can be found in. Quite a lot of people have already told me that they have a lot of emotions when they take a look at my drawings. Although I am usually very calm when I’m drawing…My little characters are quite neutral I think, but I am still very open in discovering more emotions. I think it is also easy to relate and tune in your own emotion to my work as well. But my characters are usually mostly very neutral and observant. I see so it is not completely intentional - wherever you place your characters… Yes. My drawings are mostly trying to create a mood - the way you feel. But for the characters they don't have their own. For me, you are becoming the character already - an observant. You are basically invited to observe and look at your mood, emotions through the drawing. You may relate to it or you may not. I also heard that you are a Haruki Murakami fan? Me too! I was wondering if there is any inspiration that you get from his stories and his books? I really like his storytelling and his eternity as he writes. His books are usually based in the 60’s and yet there are still so many things that we can relate to. It transcends the time and the experience, he really captures the humanity within people too and the feelings and the emotions too. He can write many abstract things in a surreal way - it may seem absurd and ridiculous but in his words when you read it, you realise how possible and human everything actually is. The characters in his books also many times feel very lonely and dark. I really like his works. I read some of the sentences three or four times since he is a very optimistic pessimist (chuckles). His writing is also very persistent which I also really appreciate. He does not write for himself and does not necessarily explain things - he is totally creating his own world that is totally not related to his own, so that means he is a proper artist to me. Haruki Murakami is also a big fan of music. Is there any type of music that you like listening to, when you create? My favourite song is actually “The Sound of Silence”. The lyrics are so beautiful and the first few lines always resonate with me - the emotions come in and I can feel that I am there with them. I always listen to this song when I don't feel inspired. One of the lyrics says “People talking without speaking.People hearing without listening” - as a society we are in this state of mind unfortunately. So many people say things that they are not actually believing in and others do not listen to them. We’re unfortunately not communicating, not interacting properly. And since for my exhibition, the main component to my theme is “distance” - I ask the question a lot, whether we are still truly connecting as we are meant to. What are your plans for the future? What I really want to achieve is to keep drawing. It would be a great achievement if I could keep drawing. To keep being inspired and to express it through art is not easy. At this moment I cannot say if I am planning something big, but I really want to push myself just to keep going in drawing and keep being a better person. What would you like to say to other creatives and other women who would like to start drawing and illustrate - or just in general be creative? I would tell them to live well. Skill and knowledge is important but living is the real art. To love and to live well I think are the greatest aspirations in life. If you really want to do or make art, you need to have feelings - to feel all of the emotions and have the real life with ups and downs. Keep experiencing and keep loving it - that’s the greatest way to start. Make sure to follow Her Afternoon on Instagram: @her.afternoon Scentory Support: https://scentoryhk.com/collections/scentory-curates Doan FayetDoan is building many bridges and opportunities. The fact that a hair salon can also become a collaborative space is a very refreshing idea - especially in Hong Kong. Doan is our very first male-identifying guest of Creative Womxn in Hong Kong because it is especially hairstyling where you can (and must be) creative as well. We both connected over inclusivity and diversity. I went to see his wonderful collaborative hair salon called Le Rendez-Vous in Central that was pulsing in vibrancy, fashionable vibe and art pieces as well. Thank you so much for reaching out - I love your studio. It’s very trendy, artsy and fashionable. So glad to be invited. Are you part of Women of Hong Kong? Because I believe that your profile popped up on my feed and I started following you since then. Thank you for your kind support. What brought you to have this idea of opening up a collaborative hair and beauty space? First of all it was because I think that I am a kind of a person who enjoys bringing people together. I like the diversity and variations of people from different communities, races, cultures. Actually, I am also an event organiser in Hong Kong for the LGBTQ+ community as well. I like gathering people together, no matter gender. Everyone comes together. And what I’ve noticed is how everyone is connected through music. I’ve been here for about 10 years and had quite a few contacts and friends . So that’s when I thought why don't I become a freelancer? The idea came from splitting the commission with the owners. And I wanted to do that - to open a salon for freelancers only without commitments. And then eventually when I took a walk and walked by the WeWork coworking space, this is where the idea hit. If this is a co-working space, why don’t I open up a salon space? This concept is actually already popular in Canada and some areas in the USA. And so far what they are doing in Europe is to have about 2 or 3 spaces in their own salon for freelancers. What’s good for them is that they don't have to, as freelancers, worry about the salon's monthly rental. How different is your salon from the other collaborative salons you can see in Canada or in Europe? I really wanted to focus on offering more art and fashion inspiration to the customers who come here and also the fact of this being an open space. So the first time when I came here I thought that it was fantastic that we had so much space. Why don't we combine art, hair, makeup culture and blend it collaboratively together? The moment when a woman walks into Le Rendez Vous space, she will know that she can get absolutely everything on spot - makeup, manicure, pedicure, eyelash extensions, waxing...everything under one roof. I am constantly looking for paint artists, nail artists , beauticians and hair artists to keep the space fresh all the time. Do you provide all of the products for all of the freelancers who come in? Yes, for the hair I do provide some of the product but in general I kindly suggest they bring their own. I provide the classic standards that are necessary - shampoo, conditioner, drinks such as water and coffee… Do you also choose what kind of people you want to work with here? Sure. We have a norm that needs to be carefully calculated to the rent - since we are in Central, it is higher as expected. I like taking on board mature and experienced professionals. It also comes from the rising expat clientele so to speak English is also very important. But I am so lucky to have the best of both so far - freelancers who speak Cantonese as well and are very flexible. The vibe in here is very important.Together we are on the same page and understand the customer’s needs. So this is what this salon needs - starts with an experience. In the future, I’d love this salon to become the centre of beauty and hair. Coming back to you and your creativity and the love that you have for the hair - where did it come from? Ohh it’s actually really funny, because I was actually in France studying clothing and fashion at first. I wanted to be a fashion designer but didn't like it very much. Then I went back to Vietnam for a holiday and to catch up with my family and friends, as Vietnam is where I’m originally from. When I was there I went to get a haircut in a salon that was owned by my mum’s friend. Then my mum’s friend after applying the hair gel on me told me to try to apply it by myself. And then he said that there is something about my work with hands and he said to go back to France and do the hairdresser training instead. That’s how I started. So I went back to France, quit my studies after 6 months and started my training and then working in Paris. How long did you live in Paris? 14 years. It seems like you have been through quite a lot of culture shocks... Yeah definitely. I actually also spent 1 year in Beijing and that was my halfway point of ending up here. What a journey. Where was the most significant change in hairstyle that you noticed or had to re-adapt yourself around? I think that there were two occasions actually. When I moved to Paris for the first time I was only 14 years old. It was a completely different culture. At that time I also did not speak French really well and it was very hard to understand people. But after 4 years I made some really good friends and then it all went very smoothly. But the biggest change was definitely moving from Paris to Beijing. Proper culture shock. In what ways? Because once again, I did not speak the language, I did not know any Mandarin. Very difficult to understand and people don't even speak English there. It was very difficult. Since I started doing hairdressing in Europe, in China it was completely different. 11 years ago they were all there into a very Korean style, Japanese style. Curly, wavy, very coloured or dyed...French style is very neat but always natural. So every work or commission that I’ve done there was still too natural for them. I didn’t make much money and people did not feel comfortable to pay me for what I have done - and that was even when I was working in a French salon. So that’s why I went and moved to Hong Kong - it’s much easier here. People speak English, French and it’s easier for me to communicate here. It's definitely very diverse here. Coming to Hong Kong, how did you start finding your first contacts? When I first arrived here I started working for this French salon and that’s how I started to know the community. First, it was all French - thanks to Facebook I’ve joined this group - French HK moms. Mums were my target audience I think. So I made my own Facebook page with all of my styles, haircuts that I have done and once when people saw it, they connected with me and started messaging me every single day and started to recognize my work as well. Thanks to the French community in Hong Kong, more and more people were reaching out and kept coming back to the salon. So this is how I started to build up my clientele. It is very easy to meet people here and everyone seems much more open minded as well. I also wanted to ask you about your initial idea - implementing a lot of art into your studio as well. What is the intention behind it? To be honest, before opening this salon I wasn't into art that much. Just after I started studying fashion design, I started to become more curious. 3 years ago I met a group of people who are DJs. They are very much into music and art combinations. That's how I got into art inspiration as well. So I go to art exhibitions by myself a bit more often, or my friends simply started to invite me to more art exhibition oriented events in Hong Kong. I got to know more people who taught me how to understand art a little bit more. For example when you go to a typical French restaurant in France, they always have some kind of artwork in their interior and since I got this space and looked at the wall, they were just very empty. Since I spoke to my friend who was already into art, everything came together. So instead of just putting a piece of art on the walls for the whole year, I like to keep it fresh and change the artworks every 2 to 3 months, so it is a nice change for our clients to see and also to get to know new Hong Kong artists. How do you find the artists? The previous owner Philip Georges is actually also very much into art. I think for the past ten years he became a serious collector and now he is actually organising his own virtual art exhibition online : Brouhahaart . That’s how I get to know and find the artists and also hear tips from my clients, friends and other recommendations. Every few months after the change the space looks very different. The very first artist we had here were very focused on pop art, fashion and vibrant colours since she used to be a professional model called Gaelle. The second artist exhibiting here was a Hong Kong drawer with classical landscapes such as Star Ferry landscapes etc - Richard Marc Crosbie. Our current exhibiting artist, Mildmia, is more different and I love her work because she loves music as well and gets inspired through techno music.It does not speak too much at first sight but when you look at it closely and understand the story behind her intention it is very fascinating. Coming back to the hair - what is the most popular hairstyle currently in Hong Kong that people want to wear? Right now, people really like balayage. Balayage is a French technique and since I love blonde hair I love how much you can learn from this technique of highlights. In general, people come here mostly for balayage. But in general nowadays hairdressing is very diverse and always pushing the whole industry. People now have more confidence in telling you what they want and what they like. They have their vision and then it really depends on the person as well. But also nowadays especially in Hong Kong what people really like is having light, blonde, pastel coloured hair. Colouring in general is very popular - trimming and cutting not as much. I was wondering how do you keep yourself up with the trends since they change so often? Mostly social media and Instagram. Just purely following all worldwide hairstylists across the globe. How quickly does the trend take to make it to Hong Kong? Not long at all, it is pretty much immediate. Instagram goes super fast. Like for example having rosy hair. But you need to know how to use your social media carefully and with balance. For the hairdressing profession it is a great tool that is very helpful. If you would have any tips and tricks on how to take proper care of your hair - what would they be? Do not wash your hair everyday. That is the first thing that I tell my clients. The hair can become greasy very easily, and it's very aggressive to your scalp. Removing the natural oil that is produced on our scalp is a natural protection to your skin. The more you wash it the more your scalp needs to work harder to produce the natural skin oil called sebum- and it does not provide the nutritions that your hair truly needs. Second thing would be that treatment is also very important - like a proper hair mask and doing it properly. Care about the hair condition properly, before you cut it or dye it. Hair, skins, nails go all together - and they all need the same nutritions and care. Visit Le Rendez-Vous Website: lerendezvous.hk/about-us
Follow Le Rendez Vous on Instagram: @lerendezvoushk Follow Doan's personal account on Instagram: @doanfayet Nicole RoquelIt was not easy. Being brought up as Filipina in Hong Kong without proper sense of belonging was a tough ride for Nicole. Feeling rootless, not speaking the language and being disconnected from her own culture, made her sense of belonging hard. But Nicole fought back and did not give up to be herself. She fully dedicated her emotions to her passion. Nicole escaped into a world of illustrations, drawings and writing in order to create a safe space for her, especially after going through mental health problems and toxic relationships. Nicole reflects on her childhood and humbly shares with me her insights of living in Hong Kong as a Filipina who does not speak the language whilst being an art teacher and a very successful exhibiting artist as well. Speaking of attention spam - your artworks actually attract it so much as there is so much going on. Where do you have the idea that gives you the vision of your next work? I get a lot of inspiration from my own experiences. Many of my artworks are pretty much about my childhood as a Filipina in Hong Kong, nostalgic memories, as well as mental health issues. A lot of the ideas basically come from within me (laughs). In order to create the fantastical paintings as you do you also need to be able to do some self-reflection and internal work. How do you personally do that? Growing up, I had a very difficult time verbally expressing myself so throughout middle school and high school, I was writing a lot in my diary, which I suppose has helped me grow some self-awareness. Actually if it weren't for art, my other option was to be a novelist or a short stories writer. That’s what I was hoping to be, or even to be able to do both - art and writing. Like an illustrator and a novelist. My biggest dream is to be a book illustrator, actually. Ohh maybe like for kids books or straight for adults? I'm good with either - with kids and young adults. I think there is so much that can be told even to young children. Every time I go to bookshops, I really enjoy reading children's books (chuckles)! I also love seeing the illustrations and the covers. That’s amazing. So here is an idea - if you would have a small kid, standing in front of your painting, what would you like them to learn about it? I’d like them to feel that my paintings could be their fantasy. It’s another dimension that could exist in this real world but because of all of the bright colours and surrealist-like arrangements of the drawings, I’d like them to feel that this could be their fantasy. I’d like them to look at my paintings and look at it as a safe space where happiness, the freedom to creativity, and assurance are given. I was thinking as it is quite hard nowadays to capture, especially when it comes to young people, their attention and keep their focus going - since we are so locked up on our phones, how do we bring them back to books and back to literature? That’s a bit tricky to answer because I don’t think we can truly escape from our phones. Perhaps if there were more diverse representation in terms of culture, characters and experiences, more young people would be drawn to find the kind of literature that personally resonates with them. What was the craziest interpretation of your work that you heard of? That’s interesting! Actually when the few people shared their thoughts about my work, they kind of got the gist of my art already (laughs). Quite surprisingly. Maybe it’s because many of the symbolism and the iconography that I put into my recent artwork is recognisable. For example in one of my latest paintings titled “Bowlcut” that I showed at the Creative Womxn in Hong Kong exhibition, I painted small details that were reminiscent to my local experience like the tiles of old homes and these particular green stools often found in local shops and tuck shops. I feel like a lot of people actually noticed them right away, especially the ones who were born and live here. They recognised it from their own childhood or personal experience. It’s kind of cool, I’d love people to be able to connect to each other through art in this way. How was it growing up as a Filipina in Hong Kong culture? It was strange (laughs). I mean growing up, I did not think it was super strange as it was so normal for me. But now looking back, it was a bit bizarre. From grade one until basically high school graduation, there was only me and one other Filipina in my whole entire grade. It felt very isolating but at that time, I was trying not to think about it too much and instead tried to adapt. I tried to be very optimistic. But then I realised later it actually hurt me more than I realised. There was always the experience of not truly belonging somewhere. I still see myself as a HongKonger but then when I was with my local Hong Kong-Chinese classmates or friends, there has always been this disconnect. But on the other hand, even with my Filipino friends I also felt that there was a similar disconnect (chuckles). Can you describe a little bit more of the disconnect? Was it the conversations, the creativity…? A lot of it was the conversations, I guess. For one thing, I don't speak Cantonese but I can understand fairly well. I didn’t have to take Chinese speaking classes in my secondary school where English was primarily used. Most of my friends and all of my family also speak English with me. It’s pretty much the same with Tagalog - I’m a bit ashamed to admit that I can’t speak it like I would like to, but I can understand it on a very casual level. It’s a bit sad that I wasn’t encouraged to learn my native language when I was young. My parents being immigrants, I believe this was their attempt of survival, in their hopes that I can “get ahead” without being held back in society by my ethnicity. So it has always been very strange to be always somewhere in the middle, always being stuck in between. There were also cultural and social status differences which I suppose inform a particular difference in behaviours. I studied in I guess what many would consider an elite local school where many of my friends and peers were much more financially well off than I was. There were small things that I did that were completely normal to me, but perhaps was a bit strange to my schoolmates. For example, I didn’t have a very fanciful or a cutesy Hello Kitty lunch box when I was in primary school like a lot of my classmates did. My lunch would turn cold because my lunch box was just a plastic reusable box, not heat-insulated like many of my friends’. Some of my friends pointed out how odd and unappealing my lunch looked - my Chicken Adobo with cold and coagulated sauce. Maybe because I was brought up in a very traditional and strict way, like I was raised to think that as a girl I couldn’t be loud or opinionated, my demeanour tended to be much quieter than many of my Filipino peers. They were always much more expressive than I was. It also didn’t help that I don’t really speak Tagalog. It was always made known to me that they thought of me as “very stereotypically local” since I was so quiet. This was kinda confusing for me because when I was with my HK-Chinese local friends, they would think that I was very chatty (laughs). I also felt strange to have be labelled in some sort of way no matter where or who I was with. I guess long story short, I just felt like I always needed to be a different person with different groups of people. I was wondering if this kind of disconnect played into your creativity? How did you start building up your imagination? Interesting question. I feel like when it comes to art - drawing or painting for me, I didn’t really think of it so strategically. Drawing was my comfort zone since I was really young and the one way I could outwardly express myself. Through my social anxieties and my shyness, I always tried to draw out either my feelings or a place where I wish I could escape to. I think I just developed the habit of doing that. As I got into my teenhood, I started to pick up inspiration from illustrations and films made by Tim Burton. I admired the way he uses his voice of childish naivety in fantastical macabre worlds. I didn’t think about my work so strategically in that way before - at least not until very recently. Overtime, I started to display that “disconnect” by contrasting the bright colours and whimsical nature with the longing expressions of my characters. You basically create a safe space during your creative process and that’s the essential bit. Yeah! Could your parents maybe feel the disconnect as well since you were a young kid? Did they encourage or tried to promote and support your creativity? My mum and my dad both had very different reactions to my art and my creativity when I was a kid. My dad was a musician and so in a way, he kind of could relate to my artfulness and he just left me to it. However, though my mum did let me continue drawing, she didn't realise that I was very serious about it. I don't think it really hit her until a bit later that I was actually really passionate about drawing and that it was something I wanted to pursue. I have this very vivid memory when I was about 7 years old, I've accumulated all of these sketchbooks (laughs) because I just kept drawing and drawing and drawing. And there was this one time when we had to clean the house during spring time cleaning and she just threw out my sketchbooks without telling me first! She was like “it’s taking so much space, it’s all over the bookshelves, we have no more space…” And that really hurt me. I cried for so many days (laughs). I think it was not even until that point when she realised that it actually meant something to me. That is such a shame! Would you ever try to recreate those sketchbooks? I don't think so. Just because they were very raw drawings. They were little thoughts that I don't think I would ever be able to replicate. A lot of those drawings were also purely explorative. That brings me to when I was watching Art Attack (editorial note:Art Attack is a British children's television programme revolving around art, currently hosted by Lloyd Warbey on Disney Junior). Every week they would air an episode and it’s just this guy showing drawing techniques, painting and sculpture making….and I would watch it and draw whatever I learned into one of those sketchbooks. So that was my very early push into learning how to make art from a more technical standpoint. How do you think that your ideas behind your work and the ideas behind your art changed throughout the time? At the beginning, a lot of it was really a way for me to express my emotions that I was feeling at that time. First, I was terribly anxious and second, I felt like society would not let me - being a girl, a Catholic and also considered an ethnic minority- verbally express myself. So the only way it worked for me was through drawing. So at the beginning a lot of my artwork was about me trying to channel all of the hurt, the sadness and the wishful thinking that I had at that time. Whereas now, I’d like my art to be more inspiring and engaging. I’d love to provide a fantasy and safe space that when people look at it, they can connect with my experiences and with each other. In the past it was more about myself and now it’s about wanting to build a sense of belonging along with others. How do you think in general that Hong Kong has the capacity to basically connect people through art? As it seems that the art scene here on the HK Island seems to be more premium and exclusive? We mentioned the Affordable Art Fair before and it is not quite the atmosphere or place that you would expect people to connect properly. I think that it is actually one of the biggest challenges of being an artist in Hong Kong. It is making that connection with different communities and we are all still trying to work that out. Art seems to be something either very exclusive or underground. Why do you think it’s that? I don't know. I feel like being here as an artist, you really need to proactively look for the art. It’s not always readily there for you, you have to go seek it and meet the right people in whatever art community you want to get yourself into. For some, it can take a lot of time and effort to find the right people for you. I’m not sure how we can fix it yet but I’m really hoping that there would be more platforms that are more open to showing different kinds of artists in the same shared space, coming from different walks of life. Perhaps it may help that we as a community support more local and independent artists/businesses who aren’t always affiliated with big-names and mainstream commercialism. We need more room for these artists to thrive as well, alongside those who are already considered exclusive. Although things have progressed since I was in high school, I think there is still too much exclusivity and segregation going on at the moment in the local art scene. At the same time, maybe in a way it also could be a bit to do with the lack of governmental support to push out diversity. I think there seems to be a growing attention to the local art scene, but I don’t think it’s enough especially when certain underprivileged communities are often being excluded. If the government is not really helping us in providing resources and spaces including to those who may not have an easy access to the various art communities, we can’t blame layman people for not knowing. I think that’s the problem with prioritising as well, right. The government does not have art and culture as their priority since Covid and neverending housing crisis. Whatever works commercially, yeah. Talking about commercialism, I wanted to ask you - are you creating your paintings full time? No, I also work as a part time art teacher. I like it though I never thought about myself as being able to teach art. It all kind of happened by accident. I had a schoolmate at my university who was teaching at the centre where I currently teach now and he needed a substitute teacher, because he had to temporarily leave Hong Kong for something urgent. At that time I just freshly graduated and needed the money, so I agreed to do it. And he never actually came back. So I ended up replacing him! It was very strange since I was like the new person there with the intention of not staying forever. So my boss asked me after a month if I wanted to stay and I said yes. How was the teaching for the very first time? It was a bit overwhelming at first, because I had to give so much of my energy to these little children. But I’d like to think that I can adapt very quickly and I did. At that time I was also kind of recovering from a very low point in my life, and I felt like teaching actually helped me a lot with that recovery process. I’m very grateful for being able to teach actually. Yeah, mental health in Hong Kong is still very stigmatised and it is something that is very taboo…are you okay with telling me a bit more about the low point in your life? Sure! My parents divorced when I was like 11. That was very difficult for me to cope with. It really changed me more than I realised. I was so confused at that age because it wasn't very easy to comprehend why this happened. And when you are being brought up in a catholic environment where you can’t be the girl who can say what’s on her mind - a lot of it was about being a girl who is very patient, very neat, very quiet and go with whatever comes in your way- it was very suffocating not being able to express that confusion and anger I had within myself. That was the beginning of everything I think (chuckles). So since then I kind of developed very unhealthy coping mechanisms like pretending to be a very bubbly girl at school and then I would go home and that would be a different story. Sometimes I would just have random outbursts at school when I would feel so overwhelmed and feel like crying, only to quickly switch it back to my optimist self. It felt like I always had to switch myself up a lot of times. I did not actually realise that I was doing that until much later. What happened after you went to the university?
It felt like I was finally accepted for who I truly was because there were “all of my art friends” and everyone gets me! But then I got into a few toxic relationships there. The one that really broke me and put me down to my lowest point was a relationship with a partner who was very abusive. Not physically but emotionally abusive. He was always on like a switch. He would be very nice at one point and then at the next minute he was on the opposite end of the spectrum. And also ever since my parents divorced, I've grown a very unhealthy and dangerous coping mechanism of self-harming. So this partner knew about it and used it against me. A lot of times when I was trying to leave the relationship, he would say things like “If you’re going to leave I’m going to hurt myself, or do something to myself and it will be your fault if I won’t make it through”. That momentum kept me in that relationship for 4 years! It was pretty tough and hard. I’m so sorry that this happened to you. It must have been very draining! It really was. This was all happening whilst I was finishing my school. The only way for me to cope with this was to dive deeply into work. I would just be painting and drawing, staying up all night…just to get work done. I would rather do that than dealing with what was actually happening in my private life. And was it mostly school work or either your own pieces of work that helped you express it? It was actually school work, because we had a lot to do. But if that relationship wasn't there, I really would have enjoyed my university experience. I loved the professors and the classmates that I had. Thank you so much for sharing that. It is very important to speak about and to show that artists are not always filled up with this perfect ideal fantasy that comes from a safe space. Yeah that would be nice (laughs). It was a lot of hurt yeah….my artwork, especially now, is so colourful and looks happy, but if you would look into the expressions of the faces, it may tell you something a little bit more different. So it is something that I actually enjoy doing in my artwork - to show these contrasting feelings and emotions that have a friction. I never thought about my artwork strategically, I’ve noticed it during the time later on and it worked for me. So the teaching was a proper saviour for you? It really was! When I started teaching, I was actually trying to get out of the relationship since I felt that it was almost at the end of it. I think that when I started teaching, it was reassuring to be able to be surrounded by these students who had a big passion in art. I was surprised that they really looked up to me and asked for guidance and companionship. That was very comforting to me. I think it was so nice to shift my emotions from this dark place to somewhere else where I was received well and recognised for my energy that I put into my work. What are your other projects and things that you would like to do in the future? I would like to try working in larger-scale, perhaps like a mural. I’ve tried it once long ago and really enjoyed the experience of working on something larger than me, like being swallowed whole by the art. I think it’d be cool to paint for a nursery room or a cafe, something that can feel more intimate. Also, I actually enjoy making costumes as a hobby and would like to try more of this, as well as making accessories - I’d like to learn a little more about these and perhaps expand my works in those forms or even collaborate with other small businesses that do these. How do you see yourself and your work in 5 years? I really see myself simply doing more of illustration. I’m really hoping to be able to illustrate my own children’s book - That’s the biggest goal. I always wanted to illustrate and share my experiences of being a third culture kid. As a female artist, do you think that it is difficult to put yourself out there in Hong Kong? I don't know if identifying as a woman is affecting any sense of discrimination, because sometimes I feel like I'm not sure whether it is because I’m a woman or because I’m a Filipina. I feel like a lot of the local art community is very exclusive towards their own personal local Chinese heritage. When I look at local galleries or local fairs, I don't really see a lot of representation of my own culture. What would you tell your fellow Filipinas who are trying to put themselves out there in order to stay inspired and fit in? I guess that I would encourage them to try reaching out to other communities as much as reaching out to our own Filipina peers. I feel like a lot of us including Filipinas, perhaps we feel comfortable sticking with just ourselves. There is still a lot of segregation - understandably we also want to stick with things that we know and are comfortable to us. It is definitely good to be part of your own community and have support but it is also super helpful if we ourselves reach out to other communities from other cultures and heritage too. I would really encourage that. Do you think that the Chinese community is the hardest one to reach out to? In a way, I think so. Not only because of the language that can act as a large barrier from connection, but also and moreso because of some of the societal issues that are deep-rooted and are still being dealt with today - issues concerning things like racism, colorism and classism. What would you tell your 8 year old self? That there is nothing wrong with me (laughs) and that I am enough. All that sadness, anger and confusion… they are all valid. Just keep on going with what you love, and the right people will come your way! Follow Nicole’s work on Instagram: @nicroquel.illustration Website: https://nicoleroquel.bigcartel.com/ Gallery website: https://www.clubthird.com/our-artists/nicole-roquel/ Katie Flowers - Art Therapist and Art TeacherKatie’s journey has been full of twists and turns that have challenged her to find her own voice and her own route to self-expression. Along the way she has faced deep personal grief, whilst finding strength to connect local communities through various art projects in Hong Kong. Katie has been remarkably busy and has blended Art Education and Art Therapy – to create a platform and a safe space within her Wild at Art Studio for people to find their own voice and to be able to express themselves. In her vibrant studio, we sat down, played some Coldplay and immersed ourselves into Katie’s fantastic energy and love for connecting people together through what she loves. How long has your wonderful studio been open for? I moved here 3 years ago. Before that I was teaching art at Hong Kong International School then I was credentialed to be an Art Therapist. Was there anything that happened at the HK International school that inspired you to pursue a career in Art therapy? I think it was a very comfortable decision, an organic and natural shift. I came to Hong Kong in the early 90’s to work in art education. And during that time, I was teaching art and dance as well. I loved it; I was so grateful to meet other people in the same field back then. I started working early on with somebody called Lindsey and we worked on bringing - a bit like you - creative people together and pulling kids in from different schools to perform and exhibit art together, at the same time, so schools could share ideas. Then it was called Hong Kong Youth Arts Festival. Lindsey worked on the performance side while I worked on the visual arts. I was teaching in my school too, whilst working on visual arts projects in the community, meeting different artists and art teachers. That is amazing. What kinds of jobs? So for example I worked with the Vietnamese refugee camps, the local correctional centres, many local schools, working with teachers as well as hundreds of kids. I think that a lot of the projects we were creating with groups were very therapeutic but didn’t call it art therapy back then. I also presented a couple of art slots on RTHK Radio 3 as well. That is what I call busy! Yes! And I was a musical performer and occasional actor during that time as well. It was a wonderful, fizzy, exciting time. Very diverse and colourful as well! The Fringe Club back then was the home to a large and vibrant community of creative people. It’s a different environment now. Back then it was a bit scruffier, it would be a place where you would go and see very low-key music that you wouldn't have to necessarily pay for, poetry nights - well everything happened there. I had my own art exhibition and several performances there as well. There was a lot going on and it was so much fun. What changed after these times? Then my son was born in 1997 and I couldn't do 3 jobs all at the same time. I had to whittle everything down, so kept my job part time at the school for a couple of years so I could be a mum at home. I said goodbye to my job at Youth Arts but remained involved through creating Visual Arts and Performance projects to bring schools and groups together on a huge scale, such as Walking on the Ceiling, which focussed on the works of Renaissance Artists, Michelangelo and Leonardo Da Vinci. So engaging! Did you have a chance during these times to make your own art as well? (Thinks)...Yes I did! Of course I did (chuckles). When I arrived in Hong Kong I made masks which I had started to do at Uni. They were theatre art masks, working with traditional materials. But I had a tiny flat and I am a compulsive art maker, so it kept me inspired. It was also one of the ways that Lindsey and I became friends. We had a very close friendship through shared interests, sharing our jobs at Youth Arts, many joint projects and family life too. Then I moved to Lamma Island which was a very different vibe with a friendly community. I decided to make friends by holding a mask making art project in my garden called Phenomenal Woman, it worked! And led me to make very powerful lifelong friendships which have really sustained me through all of my time on Lamma really. What are your values regarding the arts and the community? Making art together creates community, simple as that! Once people share those moments of collaboration and vulnerability, bonds are formed. The connectivity is about people finding their voices through art and being able to express themselves. Soul Sisters When Christie was very small, I had a job through ISTA (International Schools Theatre Association) at the Taipei American School facilitating dance workshops. I met a woman called Cat Ventura. That was like soul mating, we super connected on so many levels especially our art and our beliefs! We have remained dear friends since then and have maintained that friendship by meeting up in different countries as Cat moved or I travelled. We have shared a deep personal creative journey. We were both teaching in international schools back then. The IB Diploma Art course required students to make these incredible research workbooks to support their art journey and as an IB examiner I got read these books before meeting the students who made them. It was through teaching the development of IB Research workbooks that Cat and I really deepened our own Sketch-booking practice and took it further. Really what we were doing is called visual art journaling. We have shared this journaling practice together to this day. Ohh as you run those classes now as I’ve seen on your website. Yes! Now I have books everywhere. That was powerful because art journaling is an art therapy. At the end of the day art journaling is about communicating with yourself - using the visual as your mirror between you and the page. That has been a very sustaining process for me for many reasons, I experienced some significant deaths in the middle of 2000’s. I think that process was potent and integral to my own processing and dealing with such tragedy – helping me to stay sane and working through it all. Have you ever been blocked? That must’ve been very difficult to be disconnected from your flow… Yes I have been blocked! There was a time that I had this terrible feeling that I could not make art anymore. I was sharing a studio on Lamma with someone who was prolific! She would be up all night making amazing Renaissance murals on the wall! I mean, she was amazing, but she couldn't stop, she was very manic. And for me at this time I was dealing with grief, and I felt like I didn't have a voice anymore and had nothing else to say. That was hard. My internal voice was saying to myself: “You’ve rented a studio, you’re just a fraud, what were you even thinking?!” And I thought that the only thing to do was to continue my little sketchbooks books because no one has to see inside, and I just started this new approach to using my books in a more personal way. Not really as a diary but a whole blend of different things. Just to basically project your subconsciousness? Yeah! It was my safe space. And that was just powerful and wonderful. It was the best thing I could have done. Then eventually I did find my own voice. At the same time my son was little, and he was interested in the natural world. Which resonated very much with how my dad raised and taught me to love nature and growing things. - that was a very lovely connection. And then I began to gather groups of children on Lamma every Saturday, and we formed a little group called the Lamma Island Earth Keepers. It was just lovely! I did it that for years and those experiences expanded into my journaling and the children had their own little journals as well. I still see those kids today, but they are all about 25 now. At some point I was doing research for one of my IB Art students and I stumbled across Earth Poetry created by a man called John Caddy. He became an access point for me into finding out more as he was connected to Hamline University in Minneapolis that offered an MA in Art and Earth education. What a combo! What a combo, indeed. I transitioned to teaching at HKIS where they actually sponsor you to study. And everyone was getting their Master’s in Pedagogical things - which did not intrigue me. So I wrote to John! He said - let’s talk to the office. So, I ended up connecting with this really beautiful course and I did a Master's Degree in Art and Earth Education and HKIS wonderfully supported me through the whole thing and I used many Earth Based Art projects with students. I’ve always been connected to art and to nature education. Have you also still had a chance to keep working with the local communities as well? I did that as well as I continued developing new art projects within my community - cause I always had a lot of love for bringing people together. Then my mum died. That was just the worst thing - that was the hardest, worst…I did not even know what to do. It was the most disorienting thing in the world. All I could think about was that I could not go back to England now? And again as you stumble over things at the right time, a couple of the people who I followed online in the Art Journaling world were going to be teaching at an Art Retreat on the UK called ‘Call of the Wild Soul’. So I knew that I had to go to this thing. And it was in September so I had to go to my boss and told her that I found this “professional development” (chuckles) and I told her that I would be happy to take an unpaid leave. But I was called to do it for sure! So you went back to England… Yes. I attended this beautiful event in a lovely old stately home. There were 75 women there and that changed everything for me. Not only did I connect with a significant group of like-minded women in England, we are still connected and doing events together - some of them have been to Hong Kong as well! I found that I met these world-famous teachers at the retreat who were doing exactly what I do ! It was this wonderful echo. And afterwards I just wrote and wrote a kind of manifesto for my next steps in life. I arrived back in Hong Kong knew plan of what I wanted to do. It was about connecting my soul voice to a deeper purpose. I get on with kids and teenagers very well but I started to offer various art workshops with adults and found the resonance I was looking for and it was a deeper and wider thing. It was all about helping people to find your own voice and I knew I needed to create my own Art Retreat. I talked to my husband after the arrival and told him: “We’re going to find a venue for this art retreat!” – though that was so much harder than you would realise! Oh really, how come? Because most of these venues that I was after were owned by a Christian organisations that require affiliation, so we travelled around HK and eventually through a friend in HKIS we found this utterly beautiful venue in New Territories, Tao Fong San. This is where we held our first Art Journaling Retreat. We did not say it was for women exclusively but generally it is usually just women who attend. And it was an absolutely beautiful 2 and a half days and that’s when I knew I had come home to my purpose. Who was your biggest influence during your journey? My dear work partner Claire for sure - she made so much possible for me through her unfailing support. Cat Ventura who then moved to Hong Kong! It was wonderful! She walked into my HKIS art room one day which was very precious, and we continued to build our art practice together. My work with Lindsey played a big part in my life. She had a great belief in my abilities to tackle anything, so I learned fast and had so many wonderful experiences. My friend Cat then transitioned through her own personal journey with journaling into studying Art Therapy. I travelled much of this journey with her too. She would give me books to read and we would endlessly discuss the healing powers of Art for ourselves and others. We still met around the world - still journaling together in coffee shops. I eventually found an Art Therapy course in Vancouver which would allow me to do distance learning from Hong Kong. So that was a very beautiful time for 2 years and I went to Vancouver for 2 wonderful summers and met amazing people. Everything was the right thing at the right time. Sounds very holistic as well. That you picked up all of those pieces that you needed during that time as well. I knew that my time helping with children and people passing their exams was done. My own need to express myself led me to know that Art making heals and makes people feel better, that it does not matter if you are good or bad or art that’s not the point. Absolutely - especially when the expression is so unique and different to everyone. But let’s come back a little bit - have you always been creative, have you also had some influence from your parents? My parents say were not artistic - but that is not a true statement. doing. So my dad was a keyboard player and musician, my mum danced and she was a big dance influence on me. What kind of a dance did your mum do? She would do Scottish dancing, ballroom dancing, jazz dancing in various groups. But I work best with improvisational dance - expressive dance. That was part of my Expressive Art first degree course and I brought that with me to HK and I used to teach dance through my years as a teacher in the 90’s. More recently I was part of a dance group called ‘Loose Women’ we have performed here at times. I love dancing, its energies are expressive and - very healing. Somatic movement is essential to the soul. I think that the biggest gift that my parents gave me was that I could do or be anything. I was only telling my husband the other night that my parents would rent our spare room out to girls on teacher training. They were all very creative and used to make all sorts of things all the time right in our kitchen. It was just golden! I grew up with creative women who came to our home to use the spare room. So I guess much came from there. I guess that once when you came to Hong Kong, then the difference between art and expression must’ve been quite a culture shock. Actually not really. I love art expressions here. You just need to look harder for it in Hong Kong. I love it. I find local people fascinating and they are sources of incredible ideas, but it’s just not on the surface. Like everything here, you need to look down the alleyways to find things sometimes. How do you evoke creativity or trigger people to be more expressive? Well, just like anywhere else people are not that different. Certainly, when I worked for Youths Arts I would find myself in schools with very little in the way of art facilities, I have been in schools where teachers have made a shed of a roof into an art room or even a cupboard. I worked with some phenomenal, mixed demographic schools and teachers. Creativity is out there. In the local community the 90’s was full of emerging installation artists and the Fringe Club would bring all sorts of creative people together. There’s the commercial art scene of the Hollywood Road galleries and then there’s the wellspring of all the creativity that is happening in other places too. When you mentioned that the expression is not necessarily on the surface, I was wondering is it because of the attitude towards artwork because it doesn't make enough money or is it cultural, the shyness of being able to express yourself? I think it's a very different scene in Hong Kong. It's a great question to answer because it is makes me think about how I regard Hong Kong people. To get to know Hong Kong people, you need to scratch the surface a lot. It’s the way of people here. Because they do not open up so quickly they might appear non participatory. They might seem conservative or quiet. The protests were phenomenal for art! That really is a rich way to show you and explain to you what I am trying to convey - people just do not wear as much on their sleeves here as we in the West do. I love Hong Kong people for that - just being away from the radar and a bit more “pop up” (laughs). But it is all going on, flowing around us: the Be Water philosophy. When I have groups of kids in here I am so excited about what they’ve got to say because it is always so unexpected and unconventional. They are not so “showy” I love it. Do you think that “the water” still has a chance to be expressed properly in these times? Great question. But I don't have the answer to that. Certain prominent artistic people have left. Local people for the most part live in housing estates, not where “gweilos” live and they are doing their own thing in their own spaces, it’s happening. I’m very passionate about Hong Kong people. My husband was born here, my son was born here and I’ve been here for 32 years. I worked locally mostly through Youth Arts and World Wild Life and through the NGO work I do now. This studio tends to be predominantly an expat location. Coming back to Art Therapy - and as you mentioned you have more expats coming to your studio, but when it comes to therapy and mental health in general, in my own experience I’ve noticed that the stigma surrounding mental health is still out there and it is something that is still taboo. Is there a way you can approach even the local communities with art therapy? I’m in a professional group of x 30 other art therapists in Hong Kong. Probably only 2 of us are Western and we are in touch with each other about different projects. Some of them come here to run their own workshops. Primarily the art therapists that I know tend to work in certain facilities - psychiatric ones, halfway houses, housing estates…It is changing - like everything else in Hong Kong since I’ve been here. But yes, mental health is still somewhat stigmatised. I was wondering how difficult it may be with locals to be able to express themselves and connect with their subconsciousness - introducing them to your safe place? Sometimes I wonder about the word ‘therapy’ - I wish there was another way we could frame the word. That word worries people. It is very powerful how everyone has their own story and younger people are more willing to contemplate therapy as a growth process and not as a stigmatised process. I think that’s not the case in all demographics - my first art therapy client ever was a senior banker in Hong Kong whose life crashed - almost in line with the growth of his success. The crash is what led him to seek help. Therapy asks you to be vulnerable and it is usually a fear that keeps people away. Fear of themselves and a fear of what they might find. I always think about it as an investigation. You never know what you might find. When we look at the top of the iceberg which I liken to our cognitive self, we’ve got this head on our shoulders that tells us we think we know all about ourselves. It says- we are the “experts to our own problems, we are describing events. When we start creating we tap into what is below the surface, a different part of the story might emerge, because we start tapping into feelings and other narratives emerge. Yeah or about the expectations of who we think we truly are. Yes! Cognition only allows us to know so much, it comes with filters, I am filtering myself now to try and make myself coherent. Art making provides the mirror of what we didn’t know we knew. Which is why it can often be very powerful and potent experience. As you create you are having a dialogue with your art. Then as you can see it later, you might be dialoguing with it in a different way and discover other insights. That’s why people make vision boards and put them up on the wall so they can see them and dialogue through the year. You are interacting with something that was created through your subconsciousness and is connecting with you all the way back when you look at it. What is your biggest inspiration for your own self-expression? So many things! I’m inspired by the rhythms of mandalas - it is a very self-soothing process for me. Anything that calls me in. Sometimes I need to chill into something. I always have so many things going on at the same time. I love making books, I love experimenting with materials. Sometimes I want to create because I want to talk to myself. I can just pick up a magazine and cut out 5 things and I’m chatting to myself. It’s about asking myself - what do I need to know today? That’s all I need and then I’m off! You too actually! Please, check some amazing workshops and courses on Katie’s studio Wild At Art website: https://wildatartstudio.com/
Follow Katie’s projects on her Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/wildatartstudio/ And Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/wildatartstudios/ Helen LackSurrounded in serenity of art we had a chance to sit down with Suffolk-based artist Helen Lack. Helen has been on an extremely difficult and emotional journey within self-discovery and breast cancer. Her work inspired people around the world, where she had a chance to exhibit art pieces. elen’s work represents vulnerability, emotions, passion and understanding and Collective Art gallery and Project Space in UK is proud to introduce to you her exclusive solo exhibition about Helen’s journey. This is to commemorate Helen Lack’s art journey as Helen passed away from cancer that came back - a year after she gave this interview. We are so pleased to have you here, Helen - what an honour. “Thank you for having me - it’s such an amazing space, right in the heart of St. Albans - Hertfordshire in UK. Collective is exactly what St. Albans needed. A wonderful space where artists can meet, join and network and share all sorts of mediums - art, photography, poetry…” You blend in so naturally. I was wondering what was your inspiration for becoming an artist and if you can tell us more about your creative journey? “It started in Bedfordshire. I picked up a leaflet and a lady called Jeane Pickton who was about to become my mentor at the time, did art lessons in Sandy. So It though - this sounds really great, fun. I’d love to pursue my obby in art. Week later I was joining everything in terms of homework - triple the amount.I became totally immersed and totally focused. I attended for a year. I was definitely the one, as I was told, who is going to go off my own course. To quote Jane Picton: “You’re like a racehorse, I need to let you go. And then I decided to have an exhibition straight after that in Stevenage and that was the beginning.” How did it feel - the first time seeing people getting to know your work and interacting with it? “Absolutely unbelievable. I think I had about 10 pieces there and all were sold. It gave me the confidence to be able to continue. And then literally 3 months after I was at the Brick Lane in London gallery and that was my first proper exhibition. It was just phenomenal.It was incredible to jump from hertfordshire to Shoreditch and I’ve never looked back.” If we would have a chance to jump in a time a little bit you’re about to have a solo exhibition in here - Art Collective gallery in July, if people who came for first time to your very first exhibition in Stevenage in the past, and now they would be coming to the exhibition in July they might expect quite a lot of change and growth. “It's a complete difference. This will be the biggest most personal achievement in my life. In the last year I had triple negative breast cancer - all the way through I was documenting the journey in the hope of doing an exhibition. I didn’t know where or wic venue but I became a very focused and motivated person. As soon as I came into the Collective gallery I knew this was the gallery to tell my story and this is an incredibly powerful exhibition in order to inspire men, to inspire women. You can do anything - if you have dreams, that you can tell. As long as you have the voice and you can document it all.” That is so precious. I can imagine - especially when it comes to its location - it is more accessible for people that definitely need to learn more. Absolutely, but also because people that I know, that I am hoping that they would come on by, if it would be in London it would be less accessible. What is the biggest message of this exhibition coming up in July? That you can fight any battle and as long as you are strong, you can portray that in any medium at all. I chose art, photography, and poetry. I chose to look at quotes and positive aspirations.And that's what I feel. The quote- “I will paint my way through this”, is exactly the quote I said to the nurse when she told me the diagnosis. That's very powerful. How would you like the visitors coming to this exhibition to feel after when they leave? I want them to feel quite enlightened. I want them to feel a sense of emotion. I’d like them to feel and be able to visualise the true picture and a greater insight of what I did go through. That would mean a lot. If they can take away that feeling that there is closeness. Me as an artist I’ll be sharing so much of my soul through the art and messages, it is a rawness that some people would never be able to experience in their life. I want them to experience the feelings that I’ve been feeling - that closeness- I feel like I’ve done exactly what I needed to do. I think it’s also very trusting to be able to share those moments with others.There are going to be so many women that will look up to you and also understand their own bodies and that you can make your way through this. Can you tell us a little bit more about how your creativity was either challenged or immersed? It was definitely enhanced. I was not going to let any stage be without any paints, brushes not being able to express myself. There were some days where I could hardly open my eyes after the first days of chemo. The drugs were so toxic. People said - it’s like being run over by bus - at the time I tout - well that won’t happen to me. Well, it did. But even when there were situations I was able to illustrate from the bed, I was able to illustrate, which I haven't done before. But there was no way that I would be able to paint large canvases - I had no strength. Other times I would turn to words and write poems or messages.So it would enhance my creativity. How did you feel after you went through surgery?
After the surgery in terms of the healing process I had no strength. My surgery happened on my birthday, which was the most wonderful gift as I became cancer free.It's the best birthday gift you can ever have. But at least 6-8 weeks I had what they call “drains”. I thought - goodness I’ll never be able to paint, as the pain travelled through and across my arm that I paint with. But I wasn't gonna give up, I had small canvases, took my time and I found the strength in my arm back again.The works I produced after the surgery are really significant. I honestly did think that I would never be able to paint again. When I spoke to the consultant he said that the damage was permanent. And I thought that was me done, but me being me - I would start to paint with my toes if that would be the case. So you picked up a new wave of powerful strength and energy to keep trying... Because I found the way to the solution.When I went through the radiotherapy. That was incredibly claustrophobic. People leaving you and being trapped in a machine. I created a series of illustrations called Solitary figure, Frozen in fear and more that are showing the agony that I went through to get myself through these sessions. These radiotherapy sessions took about 3 months. In this exhibition - is there any particular piece that felt so vulnerable to you that you weren't sure if you’d like to exhibit? Yes - it is a piece called “Scars”. And it really is a big piece, certainly not pretty aesthetic. I thought about it the hardest - it is spontaneous, tere is just body, no head and just scars. And this is how I felt. Mental and Physical scars - they are all on there and this piece shows it. It is a very vulnerable piece. Thank you for sarin tat with us. So you have the solo exhibition here in July. What is next in your career? Possibly going and exploring collage. It is something that I’m playin with in my mind. I haven't physically started yet. I'm just looking at well known collage artists and I am becoming quite intrigued to possibly change up. Riya ChandiramaniRiya is Hong Kong’s jewel of diversity and a complex creativity. Her experience needs to be read and listened to carefully - there is so much more behind her incredibly vibrant artworks to interpret. Together, we sat down in her airy studio and discussed religion, inspiration, eating disorders, gender, commercialism, capitalism and much more. Take it all, pop it into a shaker and here we were - had a wonderful cocktail of wisdom and insights that Hong Kong’s current young talents, such as Riya, represent. TRIGGER WARNING: This article contains topics pertaining to eating disorders and sexual assault. If you are triggered or if you (or someone you may know) are going through your own struggle, here is a link to Hong Kong’s Eating Disorder service providers: https://www.mind.org.hk/service_providers/hong-kong-eating-disorder-association-limited/ What were you up to before you became a full-time artist? I was working at an NGO before and believed in the cause, but I didn’t enjoy my role there – Doing the numbers, admin and calculating donors….it was not for me. I was doing art on the side, every night after work I would come home and paint. Eventually, I made the jump and have now been a full time artist for three years. And so far, it has worked out for me really well! Yeah! I feel like Hong Kong has the sparkle of hope where you can do your own thing eventually. And the fact that you say that, having you come only last October already means a lot. This is Hong Kong at its worst - an absolute worst state. Hong Kong was amazing before! I’m just getting chills just thinking about it because I’m so excited for the city to pick it up again. I was born and raised here and I’m so excited for it to come back - the magic that it has always had. The diversity of the people here is incredible. And you were born to Indian parents - how did they end up here if I may ask? Yeah! My mum is originally from Mumbai and my dad's family is based in Delhi. My mum spent her last year of high school as an exchange student in the US and stayed for college so she left India quite young. She studied graphic design. And my dad completed his undergraduate university in India and also went to postgraduate university in the US. They never actually crossed paths in the US (laughs) but this is really funny - my mum’s aunt and my dad’s uncle were married! And my parents met at my aunt’s and uncle’s party. So they are not blood related in any way but I have a cousin that falls on both of my dad and my mum’s side (laughs). I love that!!! My parents had a 7 year long distance relationship! Because during that time it was very expensive to fly so they saved up all of their money to make calls to each other. They eventually were in the US together where they got married and then moved here to Hong Kong in the 1990's. I was born in 1994, so 4 years later after they moved here. Do you think that your mum was the first influence where you picked up your creativity from? I think so! She really encouraged it. I remember her sitting with me and teaching me the colouring inside the lines…every Sunday we would sit and I would practice drawing borders, using coloured pencils (I actually still have that set that she gave me) and went to create something. Both of my parents really celebrated a lot of South Asian art - our home also had pieces of things that I made. As I grew older they saw how much I really loved being creative, but none of us thought that I was going to make a career out of it, myself included. Living in Hong Kong creates probably also a pressure of making money…. Yeah! And there was noone I know that makes their own money from art. Having a career being an artist is very hard so I did not particularly have any role models in that respect. I’m still figuring it out (laughs). So you went to school in Hong Kong but was it already something that triggered you to keep going with art? I went to a German school here. I’ve learned 13 years of German! And it’s not helpful now - it’s been 10 years since I went to the school there and haven't spoken to anyone in German since. I did both IGCSE’s and A-levels in art. You’re given a subject and then you need to build a series around a topic for the rest of your year. So for my A-levels I chose Communism versus Capitalism. And even though it’s already been 10 years, everything I do, stems from that because it was all about consumerism, the propaganda, advertising - two sides of the same coin. Different ideologies but both are pushing something on you. The work I created 10 years ago is cool but I don't think I would be able to make it anymore, regarding Hong Kong’s current political state. I’m hearing from my art teacher who I am still in touch with that they even had to censor some of the art that the students made for the final show. Times are really changing when you hear that. What were your main sources of inspiration to that? Hong Kong is really changing in the blink of my own time here. It all started about Hong Kong, China, the time of globalisation and how western brands hold so much status here. I used to have a strong attachment to certain things when I was a kid, like always drinking Nestea - that was the only thing I drank. I’m always very focused on the things I associate myself with - bringing the elements of traditional Chinese culture and the essence of these brands. That was the series I did in my high school and then when I left for the US for university, I did not major in art as I never thought about myself as being an artist and making a career out of it. What was your major? I chose communications and the focus on gender and media. And I also took Chinese, so it was a pretty strange combination of things to others, but for me it was all very well connected. I tried to engage in internships during my breaks and coming back to Hong Kong as well - to have safety and if not being an artist, at least being engaged in the art world. But I did not enjoy it at all - the advertising, working for the PR company….I could do it though, don't get me wrong and I could do it well because I’m a Hong Kong raised kid with a very survival mode. But it does not mean that it was sparking this passion in me. At this point I just thought that I should maybe just keep my art for myself and do something else. That is where it came from. And then when I learnt more about gender studies, when I was at university, a lot of things happened and fit together. What happened if I may ask? So, when I was in my second year I was sexually assaulted. It was also the year when I started to learn about feminism and gender equality. I felt like a bad feminist for letting that “happen to me”. Very soon after that happened, I spiralled into a very severe eating disorder. I never connected the two events together. I had no idea what the eating disorder was. Until I was dying of it, I did not know what I was doing was an illness. Let me unfold it if you are okay with it - I was wondering what triggered the idea on focusing gender and feminism - was it actually the assault, or inspiration for your art? It’s “funny” because they were separate opposing events happening at the same time. Education here in Hong Kong - there was no education about gender and equality whatsoever. At no point did I ever have a conversation with someone about how it is like to be a woman in Hong Kong. There were stigmas and a lot of censorship that would just slide by. Looking back at it now - I’m like “oh my god it was that and that and that at school”. All of the jokes that boys used to make and the things that all the girls would say! I did not see it then, it was obviously only when I got to the US and got to the campus. In my first year I watched the Vagina Monologues. Second year I wanted to join that community that would meet every week and would help to put on the show as well - and became a part of the crew. Those Sunday meetings we had with this crew completely opened my eyes. It seemed that everyone in that room was so equipped for the conversation and had all of those buzz words and things to talk about and I had no idea what they were talking about. I had no idea how to talk about it the way they were. I was just sitting there absorbing and learning. And as I’m learning, the assault happened, for which I punished myself. I told myself that I’ve asked for it and how come I let myself have this happen to me. It took me a few years and Chanel Miller’s story (https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/sep/25/stanford-sexual-assault-victim-chanel-miller-interview) to realise it was not my fault. Did you share it with anyone during that time? I completely pushed it out. I was studying and working so hard that year - that time I was taking a silk screen course. I was down in this basement studio for about 13 hours from Friday to Sunday. When I was down there working, I did not want to take breaks so I didn't eat. And so my not eating just started out as “I’ll eat later, I’ll eat later…”. But it didn't. They say it takes 3 weeks to form a habit. I think the control and the reward I got from holding, holding, holding, holding was something that my body got addicted to. It slowly became eating less, less, less, less…I’ve always been a small person and since I was a child I had issues with my self-esteem…Being seen as the sidekick, the ugly, smart friend to a girl that everyone viewed as a much prettier, more stylish version of me. That was the comparison. But my body wasn't really the issue when growing up. From what I learned (very little) from eating disorders, for example people with anorexia want to be skinny because they want to look like models. I don't think that’s what I had or what I was doing. It came from a place of control, finding control, punishment and the reward. It was not just eating but it was also exercise and “indulging” in everything that was fun for me - like meeting my friends, that was all controlled by me. I had to earn it. It slowly but surely ate away at me. A few months later I was feeling the effects of what I didn't know back then was the eating disorder. I thought that it was depression. I’ve had anxiety my whole life but I didn't know about it growing up. Mental health here is something that is not talked about in Hong Kong at all. Yes, it still seems completely taboo still… Not only Hong Kong, or even being part of an Asian culture in general. There were so many suicides at my university during that time. Then I got worried - the climate was really toxic, so I took myself to the counsellor. Wow, good on you, though! Yeah. As I think that I was THAT low. I don't think that I was really a pro at doing it but I was comfortable in doing it. I felt like I needed to talk to someone because this was a very…”Hong Kong’s banking world”. This school was like that - where everyone goes to become an investment banker. I knew that I definitely did not want to be an investment banker, but you are surrounded by people in this pressure cooker and I was feeling all of the weight. So during the counselling I did not really tell her what I was doing or not doing with my eating but everything she kind of got the sense of was that she evaluated me expressing depressive symptoms and anxious symptoms. She told me to go back to Hong Kong as it was close to the holidays and to tell my parents about what's been going on. So I came back home and I tried to have a conversation with them and kind of broke down. It was hard for them to understand. Trying to respond to questions “why are you depressed” was not possible. At this point I also lost my period as I shrunken down for it to affect it. Did your parents do anything? They took me to the doctor and he had some idea what was going on in general but I told her “please, let me go back to school I don't want to stay in Hong Kong”. I could not stand the idea that if I would stay I knew I would be watched. My disorder was still telling me to keep my privacy and to keep doing the things I have done before. It’s like a demon in your head. Then I got back to school and it kept getting worse and worse. At this point, my final year, mental state was “I’m going to die”. Then I went to the dentist and he took my heart rate and asked me: “Are you alive?” She said that my heart rate was about 35. I did not know what that meant but it did not sound good. And when I came back to the school counselling they told me to see someone professional in the city. The minute I met this guy, he said: “you need to go to the school’s hospital”. The minute I got there they told me to leave school as I would be having a heart attack at any moment. It was so bad. I told them that I’m fine, I’m getting straight A’s, you have to let me graduate. I was begging them for me not to come back later. But they kept telling me to leave and get treatment immediately. What did you do - have you went to have the treatment? It ended up being the best thing for me. I was in a residential centre with 14 other women just outside of NYC. I lived there for 4 months. It was a very tight regimen of having a chosen breakfast from the night before and set meals (6 in total) every day. Then it was this therapy and that therapy, a full day of activities. I look back on it now with warmth. I’m so happy it happened but being there back then I was questioning everything. I’ve never witnessed anything like someone coming with you to the toilet, not being able to shut the door and they wanted to make sure you’re not doing anything inside of the bathroom. We were also not allowed to have certain things like for example a hair straightener in case you would have a roommate that would self-harm. You had to ask someone to salt and pepper your food, you had to eat your meal within 20 minutes…there were a lot of rules. And if you didn't finish your food within the time limit your penalty was drinking this disgusting shake to get the calories in. Each week then you would write a contract about your behaviour and your goals and if you stuck to them you were allowed more privileges. What were the privileges? Like meeting up with your family outside for a few hours, that kind of thing. Very intense. But it ended up being just what I needed, and at that point I was also ready to get better. I think that people who never recover are the people that don’t want to recover and don't want to be there. I was so ready to find my way to be better. So that year off from school ended up being such an important year for me, because when I came back to school to finish, I was such a better version of myself and I cared so much less about what everyone else thought. This was the time I wrote my thesis on masculinity because so much had been going on - especially on the US campuses regarding men and sexual assaults and just horrible displays of masculinity. So I went in with bias but of course you cannot write an academic piece based on bias so I asked the question “what is it about this culture that creates a certain kind of masculinity”. It ended up giving me a lot of empathy for men. Women are told and conditioned in a lot of ways of how to be “everything”. But I think men have much tighter cages. It’s only one way to be versus women have few more ways. And that cage causes so many issues, for men and women, for everyone. When did you come back to Hong Kong? After when Trump was elected (chuckles). I remember my roommate going to bed crying after the results. It felt like everyone was at a funeral the next day. I didn't feel safe staying in the US after that so I came back here, not knowing what I was going to do. I loved creating art but I was coming back to Hong Kong as a new person. I didn't particularly stay in touch with my high school friends and the ones I did stay in touch with weren't here. It felt like a brand new city so I had to meet new people. So luckily I found the Women’s Foundation and they had a spot. It was a slow get-to-know Hong Kong a little bit better. Through your art process, when all of these things happened, can you see the difference between the way you express your work? Can you tell the difference when you were really low and then after your recovery? I think when I was really low, everything was about survival. But I was still creative and produced some great work whilst I was really sick. But I think about how my brain was or wasn't functioning. Even if the end result might have been the same it would have taken me way way longer and more anxiety then, because my brain was in a constant state of “this isn't right, this isn't right”. Overthinking to the maximum. It got to the point where it spirals and drives you crazy. That was the case for my art and for writing my essays. My brain wasn’t functioning. I got so caught up in caring about what other people want to see versus what I want to share. So that was me before versus me now. And I think it’s a problem if I sit here and think that “this is selling really well and I just keep doing more of that”. I never want to be doing something for the sake of being popular and positive feedback. Don't get me wrong, I'm so happy that people love and appreciate my work- it's a wonderful feeling and I also need to make a living too but I don't want it to drive my creative decision. And also this is just the start of me being truly creative. Do you find yourself sometimes when you are being creative, are you self-censoring yourself at the same time? Well with commission pieces it is interesting because I like to work with the person who commissioned the piece. But I also think that if someone commissions a piece, the artist should have creative freedom and flexibility as well. Otherwise you could just go to anyone. I pick my clients based on that too. I don't want it to be too structured because I know I would be able to do it but I wouldn't be able to enjoy it. A little while ago I had a commission piece from a client who wanted a cereal box with a goddess that was important to her. The goddess I painted had her breasts exposed, but the client asked me to put a blouse on her to cover up. So these things I understand you care about as these are going to your home and it’s okay but it’s not what I would choose to do in the first place. I would choose to leave her breasts out for a very important reason. How do you seek feedback? Mostly from exhibition and Instagram responses. I try not to let a lack of Instagram feedback get to me because I don't understand the algorithm. Sometimes some pieces get more or less likes and if I let that get to me until the point where I’m reworking the piece because it did not get enough likes on Instagram then that’s going to drive me crazy. I would probably have an issue with this if I were younger. I like to try and channel myself into what I want to put out there. I get swayed so many times as there are so many people out there wanting to share their opinions with you even though you didn't ask them (laughs). And also maybe because there are so many influences that play in your field as well, right? Oh yea that is a big one actually. Right now in India there is this huge wave of extreme nationalism going on. It’s bad and big. I mean (sighs)...all realities are valid and have a reason…have you heard of a movie called Padman? Yes! I watched during the UK's 2020 lockdown! It’s amazing. (context: a Bollywood film about male protagonist called Laxmikant who is upset when he sees Gayatri, his wife, using an unhygienic cloth during her menstrual cycle. Thereafter, he creates a machine that can make affordable sanitary pads and raises awareness.) I was sobbing throughout most of it. It’s so good! There is a company in India called “Paree”. They are doing what that guy did - bringing business of making pads to women in these rural areas, giving them jobs and giving them pads. I was so proud of my dad, because me and my dad when I was growing up we never would talk about my period or anything. But he brought this to me. His company was looking to invest in it and he told me he really wants to. I was like “yes”! And he actually shared the deck with me and asked for my feedback so it was a very special moment in many ways because I could contribute to dad’s job that I didn’t know anything about before. And the company is doing really well it seems. It is crucial and vital - the education gets impacted, the safety gets impacted, the general status of women is impacted by - this thing that a couple of men, centuries ago decided was “dirty” because it’s “powerful”. All of us have so much power and men taking it away from us that is what my work is supposed to be about. And even though I write about my work, not everyone reads it. But now, since my work is getting more attention, I keep getting these messages from people saying: “You should be more careful about this, especially with what’s going on in India”. And I say: “I know, but that's why I have to do it and I’m doing my job right if someone is upset.” But I also understand that if I were to produce my current work in India I would probably be beaten to death. For nothing. As I still don't see myself doing something as bad and disrespectful. I’m just trying to say “respect women”. I’m aware of this reality and I guess I should say that I’m privileged to be here and to be able to do the work I do here and to be able to have a chance one day hopefully to show my work in India at some point. Although there may be a lot of people who would not be okay with it there may still be some people who would love it and want to buy it. But it’s just about sharing it in the right way to make sure once when the show would happen that it’s not going to be set on fire. Because that is the reality and I believe that could happen. I’m not saying that my work is that amazing for it to happen but people can take only one look and not think and get angry. It’s education at the end of the day. What is the most important value to your work?
To make people have conversations. I want people to be questioning. I don't put boobs, vaginas and penises all over my work because it’s “fun” but because I have a complex relationship with these parts in myself and sexuality. If people think of me as someone who is very openly “tits out-erotic friendly”, that’s not true – I feature such images because my relationship with them is so complex. I basically had to grow my breasts back by being fed. And my breakfast at the treatment centre was always cereal. So that has always been there. But if you take a look at the cereal boxes and the branding….all of the mascots are male. And nowadays everyone eats cereal from a very young age. Kids cereal is such a thing - the brands create this trusting connection between them and the mascots and when you see that all of them are men, the names, the voices, the general sports…it’s not okay actually. But for me it’s still much more layered - the body stuff is all very personal although it may not come across to people like that. Maybe one day I will get even more personal in my work. So why are you displaying India even though you are very conscious of the pressure? I think I am unfortunately a more “radical Indian woman”, just because I’m honest. To me I don’t think I'm doing something that is so special but it’s just that not many people are doing it. It’s just a shame that in order for you to feel free in your work and be able to freely express your thoughts that you are dependent on creating such work outside of India. Yeah! Luckily for me, this is home and I know more people here than in India, discounting my general family. I would visit for lengthy periods but I never lived there as a citizen, even though I am an Indian citizen by passport. I can't comment on daily life in India since I’m not there but I can comment on the culture and comment on things that I feel like I've been impacted by. Otherwise I'm being someone who is speaking for other people and that’s not fair. But a lot of this academically came from this amazing module I had at my last year of university called “Gender, Sexuality and Hinduism” which then taught me the scripts on that aspect and what one of the scriptures say about menstruation. That has trickled down into society, it was never supposed to. It was just because of these few men who wrote the script only for themselves and for their own caste which was only 2% of the population. Then the British came in and took it and made it into law. And that’s where a lot of this basically came from. These were the “new ideas” from the grand scheme of history. Before, there was a worship of periods! Yeah! Let’s look at Tantra! Exactly! A lot of my work is inspired by Tantric teachings. I adore so much all of these layers of your inspiration! What do you think is next for you? I’ve been thinking about this a lot. I think conditioning and childhood is rooted in a lot of this. I'm so nostalgic as a person. Me eating cereal is one part of how I stayed as a kid. Whatever I do next it will be linked to my childhood, there will be more of a personal link to me. I can draw people but they are not the main thing that I'm skilled with – I prefer to use symbolism. In the future it could be a self-portrait in some sense and possibly to do with conditioning and other beliefs as well. What are your beliefs? (Chuckles) well in general, I want all of us to be free of all these barriers that are put on us. I’ve been listening lately this awesome podcast called “Man Enough” (https://manenough.com/podcast/). It’s made by Justin Baldoni, Jamey Heath and Liz Plank who bring a guest in each episode and they talk about these amazing things regarding masculinity and undefining it, but there is also a lot of conversation about race in it as well. I was wondering what you think about the masculinity in Hong Kong people here as it is very rooted by the dynamic of the city but then of course, in India it’s incredibly masculine. In here, women still have a chance to speak out and take charge as I can see them being dominant at sometimes but on the other hand when I see expats (I’m trying to be very balanced the way how I meet with people) and every time when I see an expat white guy, you always see them with Hong Kong local female but I never see it reversed…. Yep! Growing up I had a couple of friends where it was reversed with their parents, but it was like woooow, very rare. It’s very interesting. It’s a status thing. Because of the colonialism in here with the British being here and whatever they brought was superior. Automatically combining that with gender (and that's the world too), white men are at the top of it all. David - my partner is really good at acknowledging being white male here in Hong Kong and that there are some certain things that he can totally get away with (but not that he does). Covid is a really good example - the masks in the public and the police. But when I think for example about domestic helpers or when there is a choice to find someone or go after someone, there is a lot of profiling going on here. White people and white men in particular can get away with a lot more with fewer questions. Most Asian cultures believe that “fairness” is beauty. My teacher once told me that none will marry me because of my freckles (laughs). All links back to the status thing where people thought the darker you were the more likely you were working in the field. Elite is fair and then on the other hand in the West you have the opposite – I guess when you are tanned you have more money to afford to go for a holiday in the sun. You just can't never win! Please never get your freckles lasered off! Never! (Laughs). They are part of me, I like them but growing up I hated them. So just to put a few final sprinkles on top. What do you want people to feel when they see your work for the very first time? Ohh! Very often people say that my work makes them happy because of the colours. And I'm happy that the initial presentation makes them feel good of course. I love the vibrant colours myself and I’m happy they stimulate some positive feelings but I also want them, if they have a chance, to stand in front of my work for a while to look into the details. In the details they will find more clues and answers or even more questions that I hope they will ask themselves. I would love to challenge their perception about how gender roles can be swapped and challenged so the female and feminine is given respect. I want them to be a little curious and seek out what I also wrote about the piece too to understand it better. Follow Riya on Instagram: @riyachandiramani Riya’s Website: www.riyachandiramani.com 6/19/2022 Debbie Bailey - the art archivist, Hong Kong's memories' preserver, story-teller, ultra-marathon runner and a life enthusiastRead NowDebbie BaileyDebbie preserves memories and emotions of people. Not only through art but also through a significantly important connection and emotional intelligence. Her journey is full of stories and learnings that seek balance, peace and harmony. It was absolutely delightful to chat to Debbie about her values, purposes, the way she enjoys spreading the joy onto others and how much she cares about people’s impact and preserving their memorabilia not only through art. You started working in hospitality previously…. To begin with, I studied musical theatre. Unfortunately, the opportunity was scarce at the time because the local musical theatre scene had not matured. Hong Kong relied on many overseas musical productions, such as Cats and Guys and Dolls, so I was not sure what the future held. I am half Chinese and half English and speak Cantonese fluently; learning scripts was challenging as reading was a weakness, so I had to work twice as hard. There was also this classic stigma of not making a career in arts. After consideration, I decided to change. I thought about being a cabin crew, but Chinese reading was a hurdle. I then decided to join the hotel industry. To me it was like musical theatre, with no scripts, no singing but lots of improvisation. I fell in love with It because it was about being compassionate and creating exceptional experiences with the people I connected with. ….and maybe a lot of patience too! Yes! the art of patience and the art of reading the emotional cues of others. In those years, I worked hard and progressed quickly up the career ladder. Again, I was lucky to have a wonderful mentor. When The Ritz-Carlton was about to close its doors in Central, I was approached to become a hotel consultant. The offer was fantastic, it would allow me to travel extensively across the Asia Pacific Region and see the world. After 10 years of travel, It was getting a bit too much, and I knew it had to end for my well-being. I began to feel I had more to offer than working in the corporate world. I was wondering if you had a chance, even during all of this travelling, to be able to stay creative? The creative journey started after I stopped working. I just did not have the time in the past. My late brother (Derek Bailey), an artist, inspired this new journey. He built and designed the Big Buddha (The Tiantan Buddha) and the Tsz Shan Monastery Kwan Yin buddha (Tai Po) - his work. His masterpiece is in Singapore at Foo Hai Monastery - the Thousand hand Buddha. That sculpture is exquisite and what I feel is his masterpiece. I flew to Singapore after he passed away to see this work for myself. I am not religious, but the value of compassion is important to me. After his death, it inspired me to get creative as a tribute to him and as part of my healing. The creative aspect of my life happened accidentally. Oh wow, and tell me more. One morning, I was walking along the beach in Cheung Sha and found a clam shell. It was a sombre period after my brother's death, especially for my Mum. No Mother should have to endure such pain. I was never as talented as Derek, but I thought maybe I could paint a shell as a gift to her. So - I thought to myself, "this is amazing, she smiled". I'm going to do that again! It all started from there. Coincidentally I got in touch with a Marine biology professor and wondered what the impact of removing the shells from the beach is. The answer is to leave them there as microorganisms, and other things thrive from this. It's amazing that you also took the time to reach out and discover more about sustainability! I took her advice immediately as I did not want to encourage others to do the same. I decided it had to stop, shortly after I was out for lunch at Sam Shing Village in Tuen Mun one afternoon. I came across some seafood vendors and found these beautiful scallop shells. I asked her what they do with it? "We throw them away." That was the light bulb moment!! And the beginning of a journey. These seafood vendors collected over 500 shells for me. I painted a few with them and added a message on a shell. I wanted them to know the intention was positive and uplifting and how important they are in the collection process. At the time, I felt people needed some optimism. So perhaps finding a shell I randomly hid would offer hope, positivity and a way to uplift another person's day. These shells have now travelled to many countries and will be a lifelong project. I also call it messageinashellhk, adding "HK" to represent its origin from Hong Kong. How has this evolved? I started looking for local artists to collaborate with, and the intention was to be able to share their work. I would give them two shells. One is returned; another they place out. Then, I would write a short feature and have the artist share two personal creations. I guess maybe a way to rebel. I just felt that so many artists struggle, and you don't really make it unless you are dead or backed by a reputable gallery. So, it became a way to share and the action was inspired by my brother, who I felt never got the recognition he deserved. I enjoyed the process of meeting artists and understanding the stories and emotions behind each artwork. We have since featured about 22 artists and exhibited works and shell creations at Pause Cafe in Mui Wo. It sounds incredible - it's such a shame that such tragic events led to such a creative trigger. In tragedy, you must find hope; otherwise, sadness devours you. What I have loved about messageinashellhk is that it never started with a plan, and with time it's taken on its own little life. The next turn of events was gifting shells to random people. I remember this old lady I would visit on my daily runs to Tai O. We got on well, so I decided to gift her a shell I was planning to place out. My gesture was initially met with some resistance, but it made me wonder why we are not all receptive to kindness. Has society or this digital age created barriers? What if we removed it, and made it the norm, would things be different? It did prove that the action was the right one as I would always stop to chat with her; it took time to nurture; however, I was determined and we ended up having wonderful conversations. That's amazing! Relationships must be nurtured; through that process, we can learn from one another. After taking a few week's hiatus from running, I received a message on Instagram from the old lady's daughter. She was at the hospital with a shell, quite unwell, and a few days later passed away. It upset me, but I shifted that sad energy and began writing. Since then, I carry a shell with me all the time, randomly gifting it to people I meet and find interesting. With permission, I document stories - and in exchange, I would ask them to share a message they want to put on the shell. This book pays tribute to some of those people from Hong Kong whom I connected with as I explored this unique city and learned about the lives of people who have made Hong Kong their home. In these encounters, the shell became the point of connection. It's a gift of thanks for the moment we shared in this beautiful city defined by its diversity. Extending from Message In A Shell Hk, each person in this book shares their own message, opening up space to reflect on what we can learn from each other across generations, cultures and beliefs. So out of all of these stories that you connected with, was there any that truly shocked you? Everyone's story is unique and has in some way created their own way of life in the city, a place we call home. For example, I just interviewed a Maltese gentleman. He came here during the '70s to work at The Excelsior Hotel, an iconic landmark of the '70s. As a young 16-year-old Maltese contemplating life and adventure beyond the shores of his Mediterranean Island home - this is his story, one of hopes and dreams. Or our amazing Nepalese Gurkhas community who pre 1997 helped protect our borders. They welcomed me with open arms. It's very apparent in how the young engage the elder , the honour and respect are important values. Finally, Mr Chan, the fabric vendor at the Western market, refused to take his photo unless he wore his waistcoat because he wanted to display his professionalism. You were meant to do it! I don't know. It was never the plan. As I said, the beauty of this project is that it was never deliberate. It was inspired by others. I know nothing about publishing but I will write all the stories and get the photography done first. We will then have this translated into Chinese. I want this book to be a gift to Hong Kong. A reminder of our past and what we represent as a community. Our success is a result of our diversity. I kind of wanted to return to the diversity that Hong Kong has to offer as it's so beautiful. What do you think about all of those people that are actually now regularly leaving Hong Kong? I don't judge and believe everyone has their reason. It is simple: you either love it here or hate it here. Not everyone appreciates the hustle and bustle of the city or can accept the changes over the last few years. We all have a choice, and if that choice offers you something better, then we should be happy. I'd love to come back to you though - do you remember the very first time that something triggered you and you had to express yourself? I am nostalgic, so it annoys me when I see old buildings being torn down and the lack of focus on preservation. It really triggers me. I have tried to find ways to preserve it in my own way. To start, I do not see myself as a painter and have no desire to paint on canvas, but who knows, that might change one day. What inspires me is to paint on objects that other people make. I sense this energy - it's like co-creation. For example, I recently collaborated with a metal sheet artisan; he makes large metal tabletops. These tabletops fold in half, allowing you to expand your dining space to accommodate more people at dinner. This was commonly found in Hong Kong households in the 70-the 80s and used during large family dinners. For me, it represents a community collectively memorable from the past. I will then transform these tabletops to capture memories of our history. It may be collages from these iconic Hong Kong industries, newspaper clippings and fabrics. It captures a moment in time. That must've been really hard for you to observe so many changes since you had your whole childhood based in a community until now when everything and everyone are being more separated.
Change is constant and is the only permanent thing in life. We need to evolve, but certain things can be preserved, but we need to educate them on their preservation values. What is your biggest inspiration on a daily basis? Is it the people, the places? The stories? It is the complete package. The encounters with the people I engage with. I cherish relationships and get inspired by listening. I am inquisitive, and I believe in fate and that people cross paths in our lives for a reason. For example, Jon, our photographer for the book, is the co-founder of a start-up I was helping with. Just through conversation, I asked him what he enjoyed other than work. He shared that he loved photography, and then our project started. I never directed how I wanted the photos because I felt it was his creative space. He knows best; I need to honour that freedom of expression; he has since captured some fantastic expressions. How do you think that Hong Kong can immerse itself into the circle of all of the creatives and artists? I think it is happening already - You can see a strong focus on the West Kowloon district with M+ and the Hong Kong Palace Museum opening. In recent years, I have felt a strong sense of reminiscence in the community. Perhaps it's a grieving process for some. People might choose to cook, write, and run, but some will create art as a means to express or as a means to cope. I think we may find even more creative talent due to restricted travel. We have seen more independent galleries pop up and collaborative events. It's a healthy trend and will allow more people to appreciate the artist's work. If Hong Kong wants to be more immersive, make art accessible, and allow for independent creative collaborators to co-curate events. To begin this process of "how", we must start with self. We have an array of galleries to explore. Look at things, explore, ask questions, and just be curious! Follow Debbie on Instagram: @debbiebailey_ Follow Message in a Shell HK: @messageinashellhk Follow Debbie on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debbiebailey28/ |
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AuthorAlex Edwards is a founder of Creative Womxn in Hong Kong who has media and journalism background but also experience in art community development and social media management. Archives
November 2022
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